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Andrew Bitner
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Joined: 01 June 2004
Location: United States
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Posted: 02 February 2023 at 7:56pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

I don't think there's any ambiguity or "more to the story" than Putin launched an invasion that was meant to be a follow-up to their 2014 theft of Crimea. He assumed Biden and Europe generally wouldn't offer much resistance, after we did nothing nine years ago.

Putin was wrong. Biden isn't constrained in ways Obama was and Europe was ready for the US to assume a leadership role. 

Does anyone believe Trump would have done anything but pat his pal Vlad on the back and congratulate him on a job well done?

Putin isn't going to go nuclear, either. He knows it's a hole card he *might* play but if he does, that's a major escalation when he can't afford it. Russia's military has shown it has no chance against NATO--none at all--and even with nukes, they don't have much hope of toughing it out against everyone.

He's losing this war. If rumors are true, he doesn't have long anyway, so his dream of a restored Soviet Union likely dies with him, but you never know. Desperate people do crazy things.
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Peter Martin
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Posted: 02 February 2023 at 8:27pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

It's curious to go back to the first page of this thread and see how the first few posts went before it got hijacked/derailed by an infographic from... where exactly?

I was going to write "I'm assuming Carlos didn't knock it up himself" but then I thought I'd just have Google cast its eye over the image.

Do you know what came up?


Wow.


Edited by Peter Martin on 02 February 2023 at 8:27pm
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Rebecca Jansen
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Posted: 02 February 2023 at 8:29pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

Besides the Russian Embassy it seems like RTnews (the news channel with announcers quitting on air) is in operation in Uruguay. I'm glad Canada finally removed RTnews from our country, wish they'd re-add Fox news to the barred list it was once on as well, but at least it's special subscription only usually. The kind of anti-vaccine stuff on Fox is estimated to have directly cost 2,800 approx. lives in Canada in just nine months!

I'm thinking there should be a definition of freedom of speech as anyone is free to speak the truth. Maybe then at least obvious malicious misinformation and sheer lies could be taken off the tables (and the repeaters of such cut off from their source).

Before the invasion of Ukraine I would've said the Crimea which was added to it in the '50s by the Soviet Union (almost as a sort of leash and collar on it) was of course Russian. Donbas referendum who knows... but since this invasion forget it. If Ukraine could even take the Crimea I would say it's theirs. Russia lost all such considerations as any kind of reasonable state when Putin attacked.

I definitely think Trump among other things have eroded a lot of the strength of the west and so long as he is at liberty to threaten a return continues to embolden fascists. Just what he did to The Voice Of America radio and news (wiped out most staff and handed it over to anti-LGBT fanatics) should be enough to never allow him as Commander In Chief! Trust in the U.S. and it's providing information is at an all time low thanks to the Trump clown car Republican party (they also cut embassy security budgets before the Benghazi attack they keep trying to pin on Hilary Clinton). Maybe someday we'll know what Putin had over Trump to make a U.S. president dance to his tune?

The North Atlantic Treaty Organization thankfully appears to be very strong in spite of all the attempts to divide and weaken (just have Turkey obstructionism to work around).

Edited by Rebecca Jansen on 02 February 2023 at 8:37pm
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James Woodcock
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Posted: 02 February 2023 at 8:58pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

So, I guess Iím not such a nutter with my view of how it was supposed to be
had Trump won a second term.



Why are people constantly falling for the crap Putin spews?

He shot a passenger plane out of the sky, said he had no rocket launches in
the area when it was proved he did.

That showed his MO.



In this particular case, there was build up of army & he just kept saying he
wasnít going to do anything. We all knew he was. & he did. Anybody who
makes an excuse for what that man has done is an idiot.

I donít care about people trying to justify his reasons, heís invaded a
country, blown up towns, killed countless people. Donít lose sight of that by
quoting Russian embassy propaganda. Heís invaded a country, wrecked an
already fragile world economy.

I wanted a softer world after the pandemic. He saw an opportunity but got it
so, so wrong.

If you try to justify what he has done, youíre as evil as he is.
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Rodrigo castellanos
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Posted: 04 February 2023 at 3:13am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Besides the Russian Embassy it seems like RTnews (the news channel with announcers quitting on air) is in operation in Uruguay.

Heh, not at all.

We're under a moderate right wing government right now and they actually banned RT from all cable operators. And Uruguay in general, even under left wing governments which I voted for, has always been pretty much pro-US on every international matter. 

We're not Venezuela.


I definitely think Trump among other things have eroded a lot of the strength of the west and so long as he is at liberty to threaten a return continues to embolden fascists.

And I definitely agree with this, and I also think the Russian government had a lot to do with that, even when it's unfashionable to say that now with the "Russia-Gate" debunkers having apparently "won" this particular debate right now.

I still think something fishy happened there, and of course they played Trump like a fiddle.

But... (and again, not justifying Putin in any way) I still don't get why the US gets to world police on this matter.




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Peter Martin
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Posted: 04 February 2023 at 4:06am | IP Logged | 6 post reply


 QUOTE:
But... (and again, not justifying Putin in any way) I still don't get why the US gets to world police on this matter.

Which would be fair comment if not for that the topic at hand sprung from what seemed to be a justification of Putin's actions.

i.e. Doomday clock moves closer to midnight----> infographic of NATO encroaching on Russia (including miraculous NATO bases in Pakistan, and Afghanistan) -----> Current discussion.

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