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Eric Ladd
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Posted: 02 June 2018 at 3:54pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

Isn't it all just a bit hypocritical to:

- Demand equal treatment for Rump with regard to Hilary in light of how Obama was treated during his two terms?
- Demand Samantha Bee be fired when Nugent was invited to the White House.
- Demand equal treatment for Nazis when the US fought to defeat that very ideology.
- Demand Hilary be prosecuted after nothing revealed in massive investigations, but Rump be ignored after multiple indictments.

I could go on, but if someone is upset that a FORMER politician wasn't caught for something get over it. I had to get over the theft of a Supreme Justice seat, untold days of birther bullshit and shiftless government while children were shot and killed while going to school. I thought Reagan, Bush (both), Cheney and Clinton (both) all got away with something, but it is silly to try to go back after those politicians. Rump is setting the land speed record for hypocrisy in office and doing a great deal of damage to the country. I'm sure there is more going on than the citizenry will realize, but to claim he is being treated unfairly is ridiculous. He is in office and subject to immense scrutiny. Either fly right and be untouchable because your deeds like Obama (no scandal), or be prepared for people to do everything in their power to take you down.
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Eric Sofer
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Posted: 02 June 2018 at 3:55pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

Someone is missing a point here, and I'm afraid it's not me. I've read references to Kennedy, to both Clintons, to Obama, and others, and then using them to seemingly grant pardon or even forgiveness to Trump.

President Kennedy - and a lot of former presidents - was apparently quite the energetic fellow with other women besides his wife. President Clinton apparently can be included in this set. So what?

Hillary Clinton was Secretary of State, and a lot of things happened during her tenure - some that have possibly been bad choices. So what?

George W. Bush sat in a kindergarten classroom while the United States of America was under attack by an enemy agency, and he just kept reading that book. So what?

What previous officials did in Washington D.C. has nothing to do with Trump's behavior and actions during his reign. These stand on their own, not in a relational comparison, e.g., "President Johnson did this, that, and the other thing, and that was way worse than what Trump did."

Trump made hateful remarks when he was running; he made campaign promises that were going to be lies (as, granted, so many other candidates have); he publicly asked for Russian assistance; he had questionable actions and comments from his campaign team; and then, after he was elected, he doubled down on a lot of these or reinforced them.

Technically, he does not to have to stay consistent or tell the truth; I don't think that's part of the Constitution. But he lies regularly*, compromises national security regularly, contradicts his spokespeople and press secretaries regularly, and - so I observe - regularly violates his oath to support the Constitution.

I don't know him personally, and he might be a kind, generous, friendly person. I haven't followed every single action he's taken as president (although God knows it feels as if I have...) and he may have done many good things. All I know is what all f the American public knows; what he says, what he tweets, what's reported by White House sources. And by THOSE standards, it seems that he is, and always was, unqualified to be president.

If you know something different, please - point it out! I still want to know what's good about him. But don't tell me "Well, he didn't attack North Korea yet", because not doing vile acts doesn't make one a good person; it makes one a normal adult, who doesn't HAVE to be told to refrain from abominable acts. That's the "adult" part.

*Don't tell me he doesn't lie. When he says "apple" on Monday and "orange" on Wednesday, he's lying. Again - adults say something and mean it without waffling constantly. Well, sane ones do anyhow.
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Rebecca Jansen
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Posted: 02 June 2018 at 4:06pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

Unfortunately numbers coming from this president have been shown more often to be gross exaggerations or outright 'untruths'. Amazing there are still people who will actually take any information from this administration at face value. Even if he said the sky were blue I would have to check because his record is so incredibly poor. He also keeps saying he was handed a 'disaster' by the previous administration but then takes all the credit for results achieved from continuing with directions that started with that administration. Obama was handed a mess when he was coming in and it was into the deep end, and unlike McCain he was able to more than keep up as he had done his research, unlike Trump who didn't even prepare really for debates or much of anything else so convinced of his innate genius his sycophants and fellow deep state conspiracy pals attribute to him.


Edited by Rebecca Jansen on 02 June 2018 at 4:07pm
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Michael Roberts
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Posted: 02 June 2018 at 4:30pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

At a certain point I get fed up with the constant echo chambering from the same old people bashing Trump. It was bad enough when people were certain he had dementia. It topped off when people were claiming he couldn't even read! Never a correction from anyone on that - not that I expected one. But doesn't some embarrassment or reflection come from making statements like that? 

------

Many of these anti-Trump threads are started by JB on a JB board hosted by JB. If you don't want to read an anti-Trump thread, they're easy to skip. Questioning your post count has little to do with elitism, but questioning why your entire post count on a board devoted to an artist who expresses an anti-Trump sentiment is focused on defending Trump.

If you are a fan of JB, I think I would be looking at things we have in common, rather than focusing on a point we disagree on. I don't always agree with him, but our disagreements are not my singular focus on the board.

If your sole purpose is defending Trump, there are more interesting place to do that other than a John Byrne board.
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Michael Roberts
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Posted: 02 June 2018 at 4:53pm | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Or better yet try to settle the Hulk vs Thing debate. 

——-

I don’t personally participate in those threads, but being dismissive of them, on a comic-centric board of comic book artist known for working on those characters is sort of weird.
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Thomas Woods
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Posted: 02 June 2018 at 4:58pm | IP Logged | 6 post reply

deep state conspiracy

---

Before I look up the Deep State as it is defined,
because I don't actually know what is considered the
deep state, I want to give you what goes through my
mind when I hear that term.Individuals or groups of
individuals within the political system who either
knowingly or unknowingly work together for a common
outcome that undermine the will of the people or
proper democratic system. They have power, money and
connections. They have sources that can spy, leak the
right info to the press and withhold info that doesn't
further their goal.

As I define it, do you not think this goes on by just
about everyone in politics?

EDIT: If Obama, one week before election day, was
presented evidence that Hillary had cancer, or was
working with Russia, or anything that could hurt her
chances, do you think he would let it out?

Edited by Thomas Woods on 02 June 2018 at 5:17pm
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Paul Buchanan
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Posted: 02 June 2018 at 5:07pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Isn't it all just a bit hypocritical to:

- Demand equal treatment for Rump with regard to Hilary in light of how Obama was treated during his two terms?

And how exactly was Obama treated? Especially compared to Trump. The birther thing was ridiculous, but it was a drop in the bucket compared to what Trump gets accused of. And it was of no real consequence anyway. There were no attempts to halt his political agenda, or remove him from office. How many people were accused of being racists for simply disagreeing with Obama's POLICIES? It was the de facto response for may people. And of course he met resistance from Republican in the legislature, just as Trump is currently receiving from Democrats. But was there constant bashing of Obama on every late night TV show, hollywood actor, or tv personality. Do you think the news coverage between the two was comparable? If so, maybe you should look into it a little further because you couldn't be more wrong:


And did Obama have Former CIA, FBI, and national Intelligence Directors constantly berating and writing books about him? Did he have a former secretary of State meeting with Iranian officials behind his back? If you think there's any comparison between Obama's treatment outside of, and more importantly inside government, then I'm at a loss.

- Demand Samantha Bee be fired when Nugent was invited to the White House.

Without condoning Nugent, I think had someone called Obama's daughters what she called Trump's daughter, that person would have lucky just to lose their job. And beyond that it was never done.

- Demand equal treatment for Nazis when the US fought to defeat that very ideology.

This is so ridiculous I shouldn't even respond to it. Show me where he said this, and not just your loose interpretation of what you inferred. Laughable.


- Demand Hilary be prosecuted after nothing revealed in massive investigations, but Rump be ignored after multiple indictments.

Trump hasn't been indicted on anything. And frankly none close to Trump are facing indictments relating to colluding with Russia (as the investigation was supposed to deal with). Had the Obama Justice Dept. gone after Hillary with the vigor that they're pursuing Trump, things most certainly would have been different. Instead, assuming she would be President, they treated her preferentially (as I outlined in my last post).

Either fly right and be untouchable because your deeds like Obama (no scandal), or be prepared for people to do everything in their power to take you down.

No Scandals?! What scandals?........Let's see:
-"You like your Doctor you can keep your doctor" $2500 savings...
- Fast and Furious gun running program
- Solyndra
- Benghazi, and the lies told regarding the attack
- IRS targeting of conservative groups
- NSA collecting internet data from private citizens 
- First sitting attorney general to be held in contempt of Congress
- Iran deal, and sending $400 million in a plane full of cash
- Various VA scandals
- DOJ tapping 20 reporters phones and spying on their conversations

Scandal free.Nothing to see here, move along........

   



Edited by Paul Buchanan on 02 June 2018 at 5:08pm
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Michael Roberts
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Posted: 02 June 2018 at 5:09pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

As I define it, do you not think this goes on by just  about everyone in politics?

——

If that’s the case, it makes the idea of a singular conspiracy even more ridiculous, because there’d be different factions countering each other. 
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Thomas Woods
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Posted: 02 June 2018 at 5:18pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

If that’s the case, it makes the idea of a singular
conspiracy even more ridiculous, because there’d be
different factions countering each other.

---

Not singular at all, but those with the most power have
the most tools.
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Michael Sommerville
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 1:43am | IP Logged | 10 post reply

I hope I am not seen as defending Trump but I also do not see him as a villain either. I may disagree with someone's comments regarding him but my posts usually include what I see as his character flaws. 
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Eric Ladd
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 6:38am | IP Logged | 11 post reply

Perhaps there is so much negative coverage of Rump because he is doing so many negative and illegal activities 93% of the time. Perhaps Obama didn't have former CIA, FBI and Intelligence Officials writing negative books about him because Obama didn't fire the people holding those positions in an effort to influence the investigations into his activities. Perhaps it is premature to assume a lack of indictments against people close to Rump indicates innocence in light of an unconcluded investigation. Perhaps, but it is all speculation on my part. Perhaps it is ludicrous to think the investigations of Rump are somehow more rigorous now that he is President compared to less rigorous investigations of Hilary because they thought she would be President. Does Secretary of State get a pass, but once you become President the gloves are off?! Your lack of logical arguments on this point is absolutely overwhelming.

Clearly your interpretation of facts is different from mine and to illustrate this I will select one of the scandals you have listed; Solyndra. I think it is safe to assume you view Solyndra as a scandal because of the outcome and how the company folded abruptly in spite of receiving a great deal of government funding. The Department of Energy loan guarantee program was put in place by G.W. Bush and it would appear that Obama and Biden influenced Solyndra's participation in that program. I view their influence as part of a focus to quickly make the US more competative in the Green Energy Market that has been emerging for over a decade. An energy vertical that the US was lacking in and continues to fall behind in today. Solyndra was one of many companies that took advantage of that loan program during Obama's tenure and one of the few failures. There were more companies under the programe that succeeded under Obama's 2-term Presidency than failed. The fund was in the black as of the end of 2014!!!


You can continue to be outraged by Obama's activity and view it as a con job by one of many companies that participated in the fund, but you must ignore all the positive results to maintain your stance. You must ignore the fact nobody went to jail regarding Solyndra despite a great deal of investigation. you must ignore the fact that the fund is in the black. You must ignore the fact many companies had great success in entering the green energy market vertical that were funded at and around the same time.

I would ask if your scandal outrage is equal or greater in light of the F-35 over spending? Rump specifically spoke against that weapon system as reported on Fox.


Go look up what Rump has done to curb the F-35 spending, see how much more the program has cost the US tax payers and then compare that number you claim Solyndra has cost them. After you do that talk to me about how misplaced your outrage is or simply continue interpreting facts however you see fit.
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Peter Martin
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 6:56am | IP Logged | 12 post reply

Paul Buchanan asked:

"Why was an FBI plant/informant/spy placed in the Trump campaign without Trumps knowledge, and why wasn't one placed in Clinton's campaign as well?"

The FBI investigation into Russian meddling in the US election began as a counterintelligence one, not a criminal investigation. The use of a covert source is consistent with caution. An FBI counterintelligence operation seeks to monitor or neutralise foreign intelligence activity in the US. A criminal investigation seeks to identify a crime.

The FBI used an intelligence source so as to not raise any red flags with the Russians -- AND to protect the Trump campaign. The FBI could have directly interviewed those they suspected of having Russian ties, such as Papadopolous, and this would have most likely forced the Russian to back off once it became clear the FBI were watching. But it would also have put the Trump campaign in a terrible position. The media would have learnt that people from the campaign were being questioned, but as counterintelligence operations are classified, the FBI would not have been able to say why they were targeting Russia rather than the campaign itself.

In other words, the FBI were not looking for criminal wrongdoing in the Trump campaign at the time, so avoided creating any speculation that they were. They used an unintrusive method of information gathering -- a covert source -- not a spy or a criminal informant.

If you're looking for a double standard, there's the big question of why Comey took such unusual step against Hillary, such as publicly dressing her down instead of simply saying they weren't pursuing the email investigation any further, which is the FBI's standard policy.


I think its clear if they were seeking to conduct a very secret counterintelligence operation and were extremely fearful of leaks why they didn't tell Trump.

As for why there was no counterintelligence put into Hillary's campaign, why would they do this? They were seeking to thwart a hostile country's attempt to infiltrate Trump's campaign, an effort started because they had identified a number of people in the campaign with significant ties to Russia. No such people existed in Hillary's campaign. Should they have just stuck one there for the hell of it?


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