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Kevin Brown
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Posted: 10 November 2024 at 1:27pm | IP Logged | 1 post reply

The Supreme Court laid the groundwork for what is essentially the US version of The Enabling Act of 1933.  This election just gave the orange one a free rein to do whatever the hell he wants with zero repercussions.

This is not hyperbole.  This is fact.  Whatever you think he's going to do?  It's going to much worse.  This may have been our final presidential election.

Enjoy the freedom now, because in 2 months we'll be living in a far different country.
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Dave Kopperman
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Posted: 10 November 2024 at 3:26pm | IP Logged | 2 post reply

 Joseph wrote:
And now we've given Nazis power.

 Eric wrote:
Every time someone implies that America is full of Nazis now, he might as well be wearing "Idiot" on his forehead.

Eric, dude; along with so, so many other things that are misguided to outright wrong about your post, no-one is saying "America is full of Nazis". Joseph (and others) are clearly talking about the current seat-holding members of the GOP. Context clues: 'Nazi' is a placeholder for 'fascist', which the current GOP and especially its leadership pretty baldly are. It's like calling any generic gelatin dessert 'Jell-o'.

Also, while it would probably be cathartic to get into the Jell-o pit with each bullet in your list of Democratic sins, this one struck me as particularly ludicrous:

 Eric wrote:
These voters were worried about the Nazi-like behavior of Kamala and the Democrats [...] threatening property seizure (of Elon Musk's holdings specifically, after their win)

No-one is motivated to vote to protect Elon Musk's property holdings. With the possible exception of Elon Musk.

Lastly: Yes, the far left has an antisemitism problem. As does the far right. As does the world. The Democratic Party, as a governing body, (mostly) does not. You can point out that Trump's son-in-law is Jewish; so is Doug Emhoff. And Biden knowingly sacrificed a good portion of progressive and Arab American votes by his literally unwavering support of Israel.


Edited by Dave Kopperman on 10 November 2024 at 5:53pm
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Steve De Young
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Posted: 10 November 2024 at 10:19pm | IP Logged | 3 post reply

Scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds. You may not have seen Harris supporters with Confederate or Nazi flags, but go take a look at what they're saying right now on social media about African-American men, Arab Americans, Hispanics, etc. The Democratic party is a party about celebrating and defending bourgeois white liberal values. As soon as any minority fails to defend the rights and privileges of the white elites in the party at the ballot box, they turn on that minority and blame them for their own incompetence and lack of a coherent platform that appeals to the American people. 

And lets not pretend that Harris didn't include, during the campaign, open calls to restrict the first ammendment, promises to militarize the police and the border, etc. There's a reason Dick Cheney endorsed Harris. There's a reason she touted that endorsement. Call me crazy, but when the Antichrist endorses you, you don't accept, let alone brag about. And did none of you notice that she removed opposition to the death penalty from the Democratic Party platform?  Why? Was that even an issue people were talking about this year?

And the Republican party as re-made by Trump are a bunch of lunatics. But they aren't fascists, they'd have to be a lot more organized and coherent. Let alone competent. Fortunately, the Republicans have both houses of Congress. ensuring they'll accomplish nothing. When they have power, they're set upon by in-fighting and purity testing (witness the House the last few years). If the Democrats had Congress, they express their dedication to bipartisanship and compromise by passing half of the Republican agenda with them. Though who knows, there were already calls on MSNBC last Tuesday night after the Trump win, by Democrats, for Congress to go ahead and pass the Republican border bill.

For the record, this election I organized (in a non-swing state) for a third party candidate (on the left). So don't come at me with any of that nonsense that being anti-Democrat makes me pro-Trump. Best case scenario: the DNC goes back to the drawing board and tries to become an actual coherent left party. More likely: that won't happen until the baby boomers at the top of the party all die, because we've seen they won't give up power until they stop breathing no matter what.
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Jason Czeskleba
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Posted: 10 November 2024 at 11:41pm | IP Logged | 4 post reply

 Steve De Young wrote:
]So don't come at me with any of that nonsense that being anti-Democrat makes me pro-Trump.

Whether you like it or not, it's essentially the truth.  There were two choices in this election, a Democrat or Trump.  If you actively opposed the Democrat you were helping Trump get elected.
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Steve De Young
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Posted: 11 November 2024 at 12:14am | IP Logged | 5 post reply

Whether you like it or not, it's essentially the truth.  There were two choices in this election, a Democrat or Trump.  If you actively opposed the Democrat you were helping Trump get elected.
—————————

Google the electoral college.
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Casey Sager
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Posted: 11 November 2024 at 3:53am | IP Logged | 6 post reply

Again, I didn't hear Kamala say anything about "poisoning the blood of our country".
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Ron Grant
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Posted: 11 November 2024 at 5:50pm | IP Logged | 7 post reply

Google the electoral college.
----------------------------------------------

Trump won the popular vote I googled it
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Dave Kopperman
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Posted: 11 November 2024 at 6:26pm | IP Logged | 8 post reply

 Steve wrote:
Scratch a liberal and a fascist bleeds.

Now I'm sorry that I wasted my 'dude' in replying to Eric, because: DUDE.
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Mark Haslett
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Posted: 11 November 2024 at 6:29pm | IP Logged | 9 post reply

So don't come at me with any of that nonsense that being anti-Democrat
makes me pro-Trump.

**

“Don’t blame me, I wasn’t helping Doctor Doom, I was just making sure as
few people as possible supported Reed Richards cuz that dude is too
progressive!”
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Steve De Young
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Posted: 11 November 2024 at 7:07pm | IP Logged | 10 post reply

“Don’t blame me, I wasn’t helping Doctor Doom, I was just making sure as 
few people as possible supported Reed Richards cuz that dude is too 
progressive!”

-------------------------------

Uh...for this to be a proper analogy Reed would have had to have been not progressive at all, but rather have adopted most of Doom's worst policies to try to appeal to his followers. Otherwise, yeah...I guess.

I don't know if this is what you guys have to keep telling yourselves to justify voting for farther and farther right wing candidates because they're still not as bad as Trump or what. If it is, okay I guess. But allow me to suggest that if we actually want an alternative other than "Trump or the Dick Cheney Candidate" that the Trump opposition party may have to disastrously lose in order to reconsider and reform itself as an actual left party.

Anyone who thinks Kamala lost because she was "too progressive" is frankly an idiot and knows nothing about politics. Her platform (such as it was), in any other country than the US, would be far right. For her to be any less progressive she'd have to be Donald Trump.

Also.....


Trump won the popular vote I googled it
------------------------
You should've kept reading. The popular vote doesn't decide the presidency in the United States.

To be super-specific: I and my fellow organizers in my state managed to get our third-party candidate on the ballot here and net that ticket about 2,200 votes. Harris lost this state by 442,000 votes. Had we organized all of our efforts around getting those folks to vote for Harris and been 100% effective, no one would have noticed. Nothing I did helped Trump get elected. Nothing I did hurt the Harris campaign, really. If you don't understand that, do some more research and understand how elections work.

Why did I do it? Partly because I won't expend my political activity, which doesn't begin and end at casting a vote every few years, in the support of evil, even lesser ones. The Biden election sent the Democratic Party the message that the way to win was to continue to move to the right. It was a disaster in terms of the long term political health of this country and the needs of poor and working people. So, secondly, we've now created the beginnings of a network of people in this and other states, which is now being solidified post election, which can form a point of growth and lobbying with a demonstrated pool of support to work to push the government and the Democratic party back in the opposite direction. 

There are very practical goals, for example, getting Medicare for All back on the table for discussion say, 8 years from now. Which is a good practical example. It went from being the subject of intense discussion in Congress and the Presidential race in 2020 to being completely off the table for probably 12 years due to the Democrat's strategy of running to the right. How many Americans will have died, suffered adverse health consequences, or gone bankrupt from medical bills in those 12 years before we get back to where we started, let alone actually getting it passed?
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David Miller
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Posted: 11 November 2024 at 8:03pm | IP Logged | 11 post reply

You are absolutely delusional. Great job setting the stage for Medicare For
All… some day by positioning Republicans to repeal the Affordable Care Act
and its protections next year. There will not be M4All in 2032, and there
probably won’t be ACA either. Talk about getting back to where we started.
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Steven Myers
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Posted: 12 November 2024 at 3:30am | IP Logged | 12 post reply

In states that are heavily red, there's no reason to vote for a Democrat who cannot win. It's okay to vote third party because it can help give some voice to anyone other than the ridiculous duopoly. The electoral college means voting for President in a heavily tilted state is meaningless. Voting for senate or house or local races is still very important though.

Change to the system needs to happen, but it will take a lot of effort. Most Americans do not identify as a member of either party. Something has to be done to give the parties less power.
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