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Jason Mark Hickok Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 08 February 2009 Location: United States Posts: 10472
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Posted: 20 June 2009 at 8:50pm | IP Logged | 1
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My oldest son, Chris, has moved on to girls and other things. I don't see him taking a sudden interest in comics.
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Well Erik that is pretty hard to argue with there. I think most of us here are fortunate to find significant others who either put up or actually enjoy the comic book thing. Mine doesn't understand comics but of course I don't understand the whole shoe/purse deal. I guess that makes us even somehow.
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Rick Whiting Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 22 April 2004 Posts: 2248
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Posted: 20 June 2009 at 9:18pm | IP Logged | 2
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I said it before, and I'll say it again. If an older teen or adult never read a comic as a kid (or if they tried reading them when they were kids and didn't enjoy them) it is highly unlikely that those same older teens and adults will suddenly start reading comics (especially superhero comics) no matter how "mature" those comics are or how popular a movie based on said comic has done at the box office.
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Peter Svensson Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 30 January 2005 Location: United States Posts: 1470
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Posted: 20 June 2009 at 9:25pm | IP Logged | 3
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I don't know. I've seen many cases of people who had never read comics as kids but fell in love with Sandman or Preacher. (These do end up being the sort who usually go "I don't read comics, I read graphic novels!") Though you are right about the superhero comics bit. Plenty of people will go see Iron Man in the theater, but precious few of them will then have an urge to read an Iron Man comic.
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Arc Carlton Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 13 April 2009 Location: Peru Posts: 3493
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Posted: 20 June 2009 at 10:06pm | IP Logged | 4
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I think in some cases people who didn't read comics as kids might be interested. I have a couple of college friends that started reading and even buying comics thanks to me. First I would talk about comics a lot of times, and then I would lend them a few issues (mostly from my "repeat" collection so that I wouldn't worry if they'd get damaged). Anyway, when I was I kid I never read super hero comics. I remember I was reading only 2000 AD and some other British publications. Now I mostly buy super hero stuff.
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Jim Campbell Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 12 October 2006 Posts: 380
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Posted: 21 June 2009 at 2:46am | IP Logged | 5
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QUOTE:
I don't see him taking a sudden interest in comics. |
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Heh ... I wonder if there's a certain element of having seen "the man behind
the curtain" with your offspring, Erik? Nothing is quite so cool when
you see how it's created on a daily basis ...
Cheers
Jim
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Steve D Swanson Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 04 May 2008 Location: Canada Posts: 1374
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Posted: 21 June 2009 at 3:15am | IP Logged | 6
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Peter, I've met a number of people who started reading comics later in life, and those I've met fall into the graphic novel category (and tend to look down their noses at the comics themselves. To them it seems as if Watchmen the graphic novel is a work of genius but if it was first presented to them in it's original comic book form they would consider it low brow trash. Strange) but I would also point out that those people read much less graphic novels/comics than most who grew up reading them. Two or three a year, which seems like not much at all to me.
Also, I've noticed a trend with some that they have only read one 'graphic novel'; Watchmen. For some reason even though they felt it was a work of genius it did not make them want to read more comics like that. I don't know why that is, but rather than a gateway drug it acted like a one step twelve step cold turkey program. And it's not like there isn't a lot of material similar to Watchmen that they could pick up, though perhaps wading through the comics while being wholly unfamiliar with them beyond that one book is a daunting prospect.
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Robert Walsh Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 24 July 2008 Posts: 456
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Posted: 21 June 2009 at 4:00am | IP Logged | 7
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I don't know. I've seen many cases of people who had never read comics
as kids but fell in love with Sandman or Preacher. (These do end up
being the sort who usually go "I don't read comics, I read graphic novels!")
Though you are right about the superhero comics bit. Plenty of people
will go see Iron Man in the theater, but precious few of them will then
have an urge to read an Iron Man comic.
* * * * * *
That pretty much describes me. I read the few odds & ends when I was a kid, but apart from MAD Magazine, never read any particular comic regularly. A friend of mine introduced me to SANDMAN when I was in college and managed to turn me onto half dozen books. When the comic shop went out of business, I stopped reading.
And while I'll go see the random super-hero movie (the Watchmen trailer before Dark Knight had me seek out comics again), my brief forays into super-hero comics (be it new or classic) basically leaves me with the feeling that there's rarely anything in a super-hero comic I want to read. Either I find the plots stupid and/or simplistic or I think they're trying too hard to be grown up (although that last description likely describes the handful of super-hero graphic novels in my collection, which is apt, since I first read them when I was trying too hard to be grown up). All-Star Superman is probably the only super-hero book I own that strikes me as clever, witty, and suitably childish; which are traits that I can always enjoy in genre fiction, such as Doctor Who.
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Robert Walsh Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 24 July 2008 Posts: 456
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Posted: 21 June 2009 at 4:09am | IP Logged | 8
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And before someone decides to take that out of context, this is not me saying that all super-hero comics are crap. But I find the crap-to-gem ratio to be far too high for me to sift through the shit to find the odd diamond. Much like with music, unless you have a lot of time to spend learning where the rich seams lie, it's just not worth it.
And, of course, what I deem is crap, others might think is precious beyond value.
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Knut Robert Knutsen Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 22 September 2006 Posts: 7374
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Posted: 21 June 2009 at 4:19am | IP Logged | 9
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"And, of course, what I deem is crap, others might think is precious beyond value. "
I know that a lot people swear by Liefeld comics and buy lots of extra copies. They really make the roses grow. (Or is that joke too crude?)
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 134854
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Posted: 21 June 2009 at 4:44am | IP Logged | 10
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Where can the industry start for improving distribution? How can the publishers encourage more comic book retailers to appear? One word: returnability. Currently comics are carried mostly through comic stores where the store owners carry ALL the risk. If a title doesn't sell, they are stuck with it. So what do they do? They under order on almost everything.Bigger companies like Marvel, DC and Image should take some responsibility for their material and offer up SOME kind of distribution system where they share the risk on EVERY issue. When comics stores are forced to only order for subscribers, that means there are zero copies sitting on the shelves for a new reader to discover so comics have no opportunity to build new readership even within the DSM. •• "Responsibility" is a key word here, but not the way you mean, Jeff. To understand why this is not a good idea we have to go back to the beginnings of the DSM. Remember, the Direct Sales Market was created to be an "aftermarket", not a primary (or sole) source for the product. A group of dealers (not yet retailers) led by Phil Seuling came to the Companies with a way they, the dealers, could increase their stock of back issues for sale. They would buy the new stuff at a big discount, with the assurance that what they bought would not be returnable. This was a good deal for both sides. The Companies got what amounted to Free Money (there were no overages in books printed for the DSM, so no waste, no loss. Only as many books were printed as were ordered) and a good deal for the dealers, who could now fill up their longboxes with back issues for which they could charge more than they paid, and often more than cover price. Miss an issue? Seek out your nearest DSM outlet, which was strictly in the business of selling back issues. These books not being returnable was not a problem for the dealers, since they didn't want to return them. The whole point was to build up stock. But, due to a curious quirk in the distribution, the DSM was receiving its books before the regular retailers. (Even up in Canada, where books usually arrived on the shelves a week or so after they came out in the US, the comic shops were getting their books early.) So customers started turning up wanting not back issues, but new issues. They wanted to get their books early, and the DSM started to grow into a serious industry all unto itself. And once the Companies realized they could shift low-selling books into the DSM exclusively (again, no overages, no losses) a layer of grease was added to that slippery slope. It wasn't too long, relatively, before everything went into the DSM. But the books remained non-returnable. Why? Because the Companies had seen the way the DSM ordered books when it was not the sole venue. Speculation drove up orders on some titles, and if the guessing game proved wrong, the retailers were "stuck" with books they could not sell. It did not take the bean counters at the Companies too long to realize that if the books were returnable, everything would be over-ordered. After all, for the retailers, where would be the risk? In the end, from time to time the Companies have said Sure! We'll make the books returnable -- but the DSM has to turn itself into a real distribution system, like real book stores, where ordering the latest hot titles means you are also required to order the latest not-so-hot titles. And the Companies will limit how many you can order. So far the DSM doesn't want this. They want only the perks -- with the Companies taking all the risks. Which isn't how Business works. But, alas, the DSM began with a group of dealers, not businessmen, and the "dealer mentality" still echoes thru its halls.
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Knut Robert Knutsen Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 22 September 2006 Posts: 7374
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Posted: 21 June 2009 at 5:48am | IP Logged | 11
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"But, due to a curious quirk in the distribution, the DSM was receiving its books before the regular retailers. "
Oh, that's bad.
In my country, with thousands of outlets and a considerable difference in shipping times for comics and magazines, the difference in receiving times for retailers nationally could be 4 or 5 days. Which is why in my country stores couldn't put out magazines before the sale date. It used to be tuesdays were new magazine day, but the comics and other magazines might arrive at the retailer on the thursday before (in my area). If the retailer put the magazines out before tuesday they would lose their contract with the distributor. Some rule about unfair competition.
If they didn't have that rule, the zones that got magazines on wednesday would have an advantage over neighboring areas that got the magazines on thursday, thursday over friday etc. And stores would not put up with that.
I think the smart thing to do would have been to embargo the books until at least a week after they hit the newsstands.
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Chad Carter Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 16 June 2005 Posts: 9584
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Posted: 21 June 2009 at 9:08am | IP Logged | 12
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My oldest son, Chris, has moved on to girls and other things. I don't see him taking a sudden interest in comics.
Yeah, I ducked out from comics to chase girls too. Thing is, when you can't catch girls, you end up falling back on your cool hobbies. Thus did I rediscover comics, and eventually I did land a few girls as a late bloomer. Now the two run side by side fairly well, though I still enjoy a hell of lot more new comics than new ladies!
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