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Andrew W. Farago
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 July 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 4079
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| Posted: 17 June 2009 at 12:30pm | IP Logged | 1
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I dunno. I can't help but think that the same people buying comics at
their local LCS are also the ones reading web comics, buying trades and
collections of comic strips...like me.
The top webcomics have daily readerships in the millions, and a pretty sizable number of them top 75,000 daily readers, so I'd say it's a safe bet that not every webcomic reader is a regular comic shop visitor. Even if there's 100% overlap between webcomics readers and New Avengers/Batman readers, that's still a pretty sizeable comics readership beyond the typical Marvel and DC best-seller.
On the trade paperback front, Watchmen has over one million copies in print, and Jeff Smith's Bone series has passed the one million mark, collectively, and a lot of those readers aren't regular Wednesday comic book buyers, either. Bone has reached a massive audience through the Scholastic Book Club, more than a decade after it first reached mainstream audiences through Disney Adventures Magazine.
One of the best regarded publications for getting comics into the mainstream, Nickelodeon Magazine, has a circulation of more than 500,000 copies every month, with a pretty high "pass around" circulation on top of that. Of course, those numbers were just deemed far too low for the parent company to justify, so they've decided to cancel it.
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Jason Bitael
Byrne Robotics Member
AKA Mike Keane
Joined: 20 March 2009
Posts: 141
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| Posted: 17 June 2009 at 12:31pm | IP Logged | 2
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So did you just come in here to try and get banned so you can badmouth Mr.Byrne?
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Ed Bracken
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 14 June 2009
Posts: 2
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| Posted: 17 June 2009 at 12:33pm | IP Logged | 3
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No, that would be a bit sad. I just had a thing to say said it.
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Al Cook
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 December 2004
Posts: 12736
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| Posted: 17 June 2009 at 12:34pm | IP Logged | 4
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Ed, get back to me when you're man enough to stand behind what you say.
Until then you have no value whatsoever.
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Ed Bracken
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 14 June 2009
Posts: 2
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| Posted: 17 June 2009 at 12:35pm | IP Logged | 5
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Ouch!
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Erik Larsen
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 February 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 344
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| Posted: 17 June 2009 at 12:35pm | IP Logged | 6
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Apparently everything I say is an attack on John, no matter how innocuous and nothing I say is the truth regardless of the fact that I was
there when Image was formed and none of you were.
This is beyond pointless.
Every argument here is hairsplitting and assumptions. If I say John ate a
cookie everybody assumes that I never ate a cookie or did eat one but I'm
lying about it.
John is as bad as any of you-- accusing me of ripping off the
Abomination when I created the Dragon and making assumptions about
how and why Image was formed with no information to back anything up.
I said we took a risk and somehow that's a point worth debating. I
clarified by saying that the books we left would not be made available to
us if we returned and that point is sidestepped in favor of one easier to
defend--that Marvel wouldn't blacklist us--a point that I NEVER MADE
and is OBVIOUSLY UNTRUE. My point was that we would NOT be given
back the books that we vacated and that we'd have to do some other,
lesser titles and the counter is that we'd still be able to get work at
Marvel? You don't win an argument by agreeing with the other guy's
conclusion. That's NOT how that works.
Matt Hawes wrote:
Erik Larsen wrote:
...Savage Dragon started off as a top ten book but is very much a B-List
book at this point. Even though it's never been cancelled and is the
second-longest running title at Image, its sales level makes it very much
a B-list title....
Erik, sincere question: If you weren't a founder of Image Comics, would
"Savage Dragon" have been cancelled at this point? |
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No. It's selling better than many books not created my an Image founder
that are still going.
Matt Hawes wrote:
And for a third time, if Image was all about creator's
rights, why did the second wave of creator-owned titles from Image
("Tribe," "Splitting Image," "Shaman's Tears") get the axe? |
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The two are mutually exclusive. Creator's rights were not infringed upon
at any point. The creators of those books still owned their creations
despite them being given the boot. It's important to understand the basic
principles before you enter into a discussion. Early on at Image we had
some deadline problems and it was our goal to help rectify that situation.
Part of that effort was to take on other creators and their books with the
stipulation that they must meet their deadlines because we were
trying to get our company back on track and that they must do decent
work. A lot of these guys blew it--turning in books that were months
late and that's why they were let go. A couple of them turned in
pretty shoddy work in an effort to make deadlines and again, that was not
what we wanted. But at no point did we take ownership or infringe upon
creators' rights. There was never any rights issues. As a point of fact,
Larry Stroman had asked if he could use Savage Dragon in an issue of
Tribe and I agreed to let him use the character. When Tribe was axed and
Larry went elsewhere I honored that commitment and Larry used Savage
Dragon in his book published elsewhere.
John Byrne wrote:
How's Penthouse Comics doing these days? Or Bravura? Topps? Malibu's
Ultraverse? So, no, maybe it wasn't easy to raise the money to start a
comic book company in the 90s, but making it for the long haul sure
proved hard, as the demise of all those other companies proved. And,
frankly, no matter how much money you raise or how successful you are
at your current position, quitting in order to start up a new company
takes balls and entails a certain amount of risk.
••
Yes it does. But that's not what the Image boys did. |
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Since you were clearly in the room, unbeknownst to the rest of us, please
feel free to enlighten us all about how Image was formed and how it was
structured from the beginning. Feel free to toss in how Malibu financed
things and what their cash flow situation was in addition to informing
everybody how and why we broke away and what money was put into
forming the company. Obviously I'm not the expert here. Please tell us all
about it. And then--just for fun--tell me again how I ripped off the
Abomination when I was in forth grade even though my character looks
nothing like him and I was completely unfamiliar with the character at the
time.
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Jason Bitael
Byrne Robotics Member
AKA Mike Keane
Joined: 20 March 2009
Posts: 141
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| Posted: 17 June 2009 at 12:36pm | IP Logged | 7
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It's sad that you don't have anything better to do than to cause trouble. Mr.Byrne has let Mr.Larsen say what he wants. He hasn't locked up the thread either. I haven't been a member here too long, But from what I have seen Mr.Byrne is a pretty decent guy. If you aren't a fan or don't enjoy just being here, why waste your time?
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Paul Greer
Byrne Robotics Security
Joined: 18 August 2004
Posts: 14190
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| Posted: 17 June 2009 at 12:36pm | IP Logged | 8
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Don't let this rambling throw the thread off course. Growing roses, lowest comic sales since 2002, Larsen claiming JB's return to Marvel after the success of Superman reboot a failure. These are the issues at hand folks.
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Al Cook
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 December 2004
Posts: 12736
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| Posted: 17 June 2009 at 12:38pm | IP Logged | 9
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But dang, Paul, I'm good at the rambling...
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Jeremiah Avery
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 27 December 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 2431
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| Posted: 17 June 2009 at 12:42pm | IP Logged | 10
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It'd be interesting to see any of us at our jobs tell our supervisors that we can't get the job done in the time they requested, but it'll be much better with more time, despite it already being late.
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Thanos Kollias
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 June 2004
Location: Greece
Posts: 5009
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| Posted: 17 June 2009 at 12:43pm | IP Logged | 11
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Andrew, how do they measure the millions of readers? I am completely unfamiliar with webcomics and this an honest question (the thread has me worried I will get the wrong message accross).
If they buy the webcomic, OK, it is a significant indicator.
If they count visits, then it's rather pointless. It could be a vastly smaller number of readers behind it.
Please, let me know.
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Greg McPhee
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 August 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 5095
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| Posted: 17 June 2009 at 12:44pm | IP Logged | 12
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I always see guys and girls that work in comics taking on or doing projects they find interesting or enjoy.
Take Paul Smith, he took on The Uncanny X-Men, and left it shortly after a year to do Doctor Strange as he was a fan of the character. He left the highest selling title to go on to one of the lowest selling.
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Topic Closed)
