| Author |
|
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133580
|
| Posted: 15 June 2009 at 4:47pm | IP Logged | 1
|
|
|
What I think would make the industry better would be more done in one
stories with some underlying plot that might carry over a few issues. That
way, a 2 month gap between stories wouldn't be so bad.
••
It would be better if there was a reason for a 2 month gap, so the
gap wouldn't be so bad????
How about if the "gap" didn't exist at all?? Wouldn't that be better still?
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Jamie Coville
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 02 April 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 11
|
| Posted: 15 June 2009 at 4:49pm | IP Logged | 2
|
|
|
When I interviewed Ramona Fradon she mentioned she preferred full script as well. I'm guessing that was standard operating procedure at DC for much of the Silver Age. She had worked Marvel style (at Marvel) but felt coming up with the layouts was more work for her.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133580
|
| Posted: 15 June 2009 at 5:20pm | IP Logged | 3
|
|
|
She-Hulk, the West Coast Avengers and Namor were not and are not A- list books. They may very well be the books John wanted to do-- but given that all three were eventually canceled and both the Incredible Hulk and Fantastic Four were not--it's pretty obvious that they were a step down from the titles he had left when he went to DC. •• Gee, I actually missed this one, in all the other blather. You're just not good at this, Erik. The Toddler, yeah, he's got the Big Lie down to a fine art. He can shoot off his mouth about something totally absurd and be on his horse and out of Dodge before his listeners have even found their saddles. But when you try it -- well, you say something like this. SHE-HULK, WCA and NAMOR were all canceled after I left. Long after, in some cases. And if we define getting canceled as making a book something other than "A-List", how about all that crappy X-Men stuff, huh? All based on a book that was canceled long ago. Batman. Would have been canceled if the Adam West TV show hadn't come along. So no one would want to do a Z-List character like Batman, right? What are the sales like on SAVAGE DRAGON, Erik? Would a real comicbook company be keeping it alive? Seriously. I'd love to know.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Wallace Sellars
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 May 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 17701
|
| Posted: 15 June 2009 at 6:04pm | IP Logged | 4
|
|
|
When I interviewed Ramona Fradon she mentioned she preferred full script
as well.
---
Is that interview online somewhere, Jamie? If so, may I have a link to it? I
think Ms. Fradon's work is really underrated...
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
Greg McPhee
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 August 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 5094
|
| Posted: 15 June 2009 at 6:24pm | IP Logged | 5
|
|
|
I was always under the impression from Steve Englehart's own site and other Avengers websites that WCA was a high selling title during Englehart's run, and JB's stint.
Englehart says at one stage WCA outsold the regular Avengers title.
Even after JB left the title continued for another 5 years.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Erik Larsen
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 February 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 344
|
| Posted: 15 June 2009 at 6:39pm | IP Logged | 6
|
|
|
Sigh. Okay, John--I'll bite--
A real comic book company is publishing SAVAGE DRAGON--
so I guess the answer is yes--they would keep it alive. It's still selling
better than numerous titles from Marvel, DC, Dark Horse and IDW--or are
those not "real" comic book publishers either?
And considering that Savage Dragon is still being published after 150
issues and that the Next Men ended at #31, published 14 years ago--I
think I'm measuring up okay.
The distinction I was trying to paint, and you missed, is that there are A-
list books which chug along for decades regardless of who does them
and B-list titles which get cancelled and restarted as creators shift
around. I've worked on a lot of B-list books over the years--the Doom
Patrol, Nova and Aquaman among them.
X-Men was canceled once--and has had a 30+ year run thereafter, which
takes it to that A-list tier. There have been a few pretty sorry-looking
fill-ins on that book which would have killed a B-list book. Batman has
had an uninterrupted 70 year run in Detective Comics and nearly that in
his solo title. I think that's enough to have him make the A-list.
There have also been numerous A-list characters in B-list comics. Peter
Parker, the Spectacular Spider-Man was always the sister book to the
Amazing Spider-Man and so forth. When push came to shove, fans would
opt for ASM over PPSSM any day. Superman, Batman, Spider-Man and the
X-Men have all had B-list books which were cancelled over the years.
Hell, Spider-Man has had more series cancelled than Aquaman but his
main title is pretty much unsinkable (as recent events have shown).
In any case--creators on the top of their field often seek out A-list
books-- like the Fantastic Four, Superman, Batman, the Amazing Spider-
Man and so on. When a creator jumps from an A-list book to a B-list
one, often the perception is that their star has fallen somewhat. You went
from drawing X-Men to writing and drawing the Fantastic Four, which
readers saw as a step up--especially since you had added a writing credit
to your resume. When you went from the Fantastic Four to Superman,
again, that was a step up. You went to the single most iconic character in
comic books. Anything less would be a step backward but instead of
going from a the biggest A-List book at DC, to the biggest A-list book at
Marvel you went to a few B-list books at Marvel. The public perception
was, like it or not, that your star had fallen. And even if those were the
books you specifically requested--the perception was that this move was
a step back not a step forward.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
Joe Smith
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 29 August 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6675
|
| Posted: 15 June 2009 at 6:49pm | IP Logged | 7
|
|
|
How about, 'there's really no higher than this to go?'
"I've made my money, reached the top, and now, I wanna have
some FUN without editorial interference."
C'mon, Erik....you have to know the real reason behind this
'perception.'
The guy doesn't need me to defend him, I know, but, sheesh.
We're talking to, and about, one of the LEGENDS of the
industry.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
B J Mayer
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 March 2009
Posts: 201
|
| Posted: 15 June 2009 at 7:27pm | IP Logged | 8
|
|
|
Reading Erik's comment, it doesn't sound like he is saying that John's star had fallen, but rather John Q. Public might think his star had fallen. It isn't much different than when we see an A-list actor move from film to tv.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Jesus Garcia
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 10 April 2007
Location: Canada
Posts: 2414
|
| Posted: 15 June 2009 at 7:45pm | IP Logged | 9
|
|
|
I remember a recruiter once trying to put me in my place
by telling me that "perception is 99% of reality" to
which I felt obliged to retort "The Earth actually IS
flat, then?!?"
I know what Erik means. I've hung around enough comic
book shops to hear that very kind of blather, a fast
companion to "Byrne doesn't sell anymore".
Many fans -- the snickering kind who love to build up a
creator only to gleefully tear him down -- went around
disseminating the perception that Byrne couldn't get an
A-List book anymore. I don't know if this kind of fan was
in the majority or simply more skillful as getting
misinformation out.
When John started doing B-List books, I just figured it
was a case of (a) he didn't need the aggravation of being
in the spotlight or (b) he was doing what Kirby tried to
do with Lee: taking a low-expectation book and build it
up to something beyond its expectations.
Anybody remember what a certain snot-nosed kid from
Vermont did with Daredevil in the 80's? That book was
about to be cancelled last I heard.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Ray Brady
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3740
|
| Posted: 15 June 2009 at 7:48pm | IP Logged | 10
|
|
|
I think you're right, B J. The problem is, Erik's earlier comments sound like
he's saying "no one would do Namor or the She-Hulk if they could do the X-
Men instead", rather than "doing Namor or the She-Hulk makes it look like
you weren't allowed to do the X-Men".
It seems to me it's been a very long time since JB gave much of a lookout as
to what John Q. Public thought of him.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
Jason Mark Hickok
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 February 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 10472
|
| Posted: 15 June 2009 at 7:55pm | IP Logged | 11
|
|
|
Well let's not forget that both JB (and Erik) worked on "A-list" books at Marvel again. If I recall correctly that JB worked on X-Men (3 different titles), Amazing Spider-Man, Wolverine, Hulk as well as others after working on those "B-list" books. If I recall correctly JB said that when he went back to Marvel that he asked for the books he worked on. It doesn't sounds like "punishment" for leaving Marvel when you get what you want!
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Wilson Mui
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 27 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4557
|
| Posted: 15 June 2009 at 7:57pm | IP Logged | 12
|
|
|
Personally, I would rather see JB tackle new projects and try to make
those characters into "A-list" names or teams instead of playing it safe drawing
the same old character(s) for 20 years.
Also, what is the guy to do after working on DC's two biggest
characters, Superman and Wonder Woman? I guess the next logical step would be to do a Batman series
even if he feels he would not do
the character justice (which I totally disagree)?
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Topic Closed)
