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Topic: What IS the State of the Industry? (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post ReplyPost New Topic
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Matt Reed
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Posted: 11 March 2007 at 4:04am | IP Logged | 1  

One?  One book?  I remember a time when most, if not all, mainstream superhero books were all-ages and certainly good choices for young readers.  Now a single series is held up as a shining example of a comics that are good choices for kids?  Sorry, but I find that indicative of an industry that has decided to leave young readers in the dust, shooting itself in the foot.  Didn't Joey da Q only several years ago proclaim that kids don't read comics anymore? 

Sure, we're talking about digests and TPB, but those are normally filtered through monthly books such that what is published monthly will eventually be published in trade.  That only a single book by Marvel is listed as a good choice for young readers, even if the list isn't meant to be exhaustive, is sad to me when the first titles on someone's list even twenty years ago would have included numerous mainstream superhero characters.

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Steve Lieber
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Posted: 11 March 2007 at 4:21am | IP Logged | 2  

Matt: I think you're misreading me. Some clarification:

First: Where does "one book" come from? Parker's worked on at least three different Marvel Adventures titles.

Second: I'm not saying that's all there are. I'm just listing some books I've read and can vouch for personally. The DC comp box that arrives at my studio every month has at least a dozen books that are aimed at younger readers. I haven't read them, and don't know which ones have been collected into tpbs, so I didn't put them on my list of all-ages titles to ask for at the library.

Third: What Marvel is doing isn't what "the industry" is doing. Comics are a whole lot bigger than one publisher or one genre. If your interest in discussing comics ends with Marvel and DC superheroes, a lot of my posts are going to be a waste of your time  .

(Edit: I somehow missed your entire second paragraph, in which you made it clear that you did understand that the list wasn't exhaustive. Sorry about that.)



Edited by Steve Lieber on 11 March 2007 at 4:25am
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Matt Reed
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Posted: 11 March 2007 at 4:38am | IP Logged | 3  

Steve, I understand that what Marvel is doing isn't what the industry is doing, but you can't have me believe that two of the major players in the mainstream superhero business, I would say 99.9% of the mainstream superhero business, don't make a difference.  Great.  We have TIN TIN.  That's fine and dandy. Maybe we have a single SPIDER-MAN series and one that focuses on several MU heroes.  Maybe we have TITANS GO! and a JLA comic based on the animated series.  Sorry, but again I find it incredibly hard to swallow that books two decades ago that were all-ages, young reader friendly are now more often than not adult books. Those books get collected in trade.  Those books are then offered to libraries.  So what?  How are kids going to get into mainstream superheroes if most of the characters are either off-limits to them because of age or are written at a level that they can't understand?  I understand your list isn't exhaustive, but again, how does that not make you sad?  How does that not make you scratch your head and wonder why kids can't get into AMAZING SPIDER-MAN, or CAPTAIN AMERICA comics in the same way you did when you were their age?
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Steve Lieber
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Posted: 11 March 2007 at 5:34am | IP Logged | 4  

"How does that not make you scratch your head and wonder why kids can't get into AMAZING SPIDER-MAN, or CAPTAIN AMERICA comics in the same way you did when you were their age?"

They can, and a whole lot more easily than I did.  I was never allowed to buy new comics when I was a kid. I don't think I owned a single comic with an attached cover until I was 14 or 15. Didn't stop me from being a big comics fan. I loved every beat-up issue of the Fantastic Four I owned. The newer ones (that is to say the ones created in the 70s)  were great, but it was the few Lee and Kirby FF stories that I had access to that really blew me away. 

They were coverless reprints, (and a couple of stories in books like "Orgins of Marvel Comics") but that didn't matter. I didn't care that a comic wasn't "new." Any story I hadn't read was new, and (this being the 70s) the older ones were usually a lot cooler. Unfortunately, the older ones were also a lot harder to find, particularly since I was only allowed to buy comics at flea markets or the illegal stripped-book resale shops my dad would sometimes take me to. An old story might turn up as a backup in an annual or in a treasury edition. Otherwise, I was out of luck.

That was then.  Today any kid who can get to a public library can read every single issue of Lee and Kirby's run without spending a penny. If that's not a spectacular improvement over my childhood comics experience, what is?


Edited by Steve Lieber on 11 March 2007 at 5:44am
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Derek Muthart
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Posted: 11 March 2007 at 6:29am | IP Logged | 5  

I think all you need to do is ask yourself what is profitable?  At this time it seems as though trade paperback distribution through bookstores and libraries are extremely profitable otherwise the publishers wouldn't be doing it.

The essential volumes are probably also profitable considering they keep pumping them out.  Everyone has already been paid.  All the publishers need to do is pay for production and distribution costs.  Production costs are kept down because they are printed on cheap paper in black and white and they are able to use the same distribution system they already have in place.

These two trends indicate to me that indeed the American comicbook in it's current form is on the way out.  The monthly serialized editions are too short and not as profitable as their collated counterparts.

This trend really shouldn't be that shocking.  Manga have been producing black and white telephone books for decades and those volumes sell far more units than any US comicbook.

I have to admit, even I'm shifting more towards trade paperbacks.  At one time I always had to have the first printings.  I deemed everything else a reprint and therefore to me it was not worth collecting. 

I was able to get over that hang up once I started collecting original art.  Afterall, anything other than the original art is merely a reprint.

Since comics are no longer collectible in my mind (collectible implies to me a certain degreee of scarcity and we all know todays comics in high grade are not scarce) I have become more accustomed to reading trade paperacks.

They will generally have the same story at half the cover price and I can read the volume in one continuous sitting without having to wait 30 days between episodes.  In addition, they usually come with bonus material that was not published in the original comics.

200th post.  YAY!

 



Edited by Derek Muthart on 11 March 2007 at 6:29am
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Ted Pugliese
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Posted: 11 March 2007 at 6:32am | IP Logged | 6  

Derek, it's trades for me too now.  Good or bad, you get more for your money that way, and that's what they are writing for now.  Look at JLA, for example.  It will read so much better as a trade.  It's a shame (on them), yes, but it is what it is.

But I am sure JB will soon give us something to buy monthly.

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John Webb
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Posted: 11 March 2007 at 7:39am | IP Logged | 7  

I think it is pretty likely that monthly comic books are now seen as a small part of the overall picture. they will always be around for the collector and ubber fan but to my mind for the execs at DC and Marvel they will continue to be seen as a marketing tool. The fans and critics will praise certain writers and series and they will in turn be converted into trades for the mass(ish) market and the characters featured in these stories will be the ones that will get the good licencing deals. I think it is fair to say that the days of what we used to read in the 70's has gone. We the older reader are well catered for with the stuff available on the shelves of comic and book stores everywhere and I think at last the younger kids (the life blood of the industry) are starting to get books available to them again with books like Marvel Adventures and Teen Titans Go. Manga savvy kids are also seem to be digging many of the Essential and Showcase books too. I do hope these kinds of child friendly books continue to be made available becasue if they do I see no reason why comics should not be enjoyed by people from cradle to grave.
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Zane Kindley
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Posted: 11 March 2007 at 4:07pm | IP Logged | 8  

I am out of the loop in regards to most modern comics but it seems that the art began to generally go downhill in the 90's and the story lines along with it. Likewise, I just don't care for the constantly dark overtones of virtually every series along with violence for violence sake. A "dark" hero such as Batman or Wolverine is great but when every character is likewise so troubled, I just think it takes away from uniquiness of the concept.  I would have a hard time having my children read many of the comics on the market now.  I don't think comics should be written just for kids and I think that mature topics can be broached but I really miss the days when I was a kid (60s and 70s) when you could read a story and know who the hero was and while he or she may be conflicted, you would know that they would make (however difficult) the right choice....

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Paulo Pereira
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Posted: 11 March 2007 at 4:24pm | IP Logged | 9  


 QUOTE:
These two trends indicate to me that indeed the American comicbook in it's current form is on the way out.  The monthly serialized editions are too short and not as profitable as their collated counterparts.

Without monthly editions, there wouldn't be anything to collect in trade.  Unless a writer and artist get together and produced 10 comics worth of stuff to be released every year or whatever.  In which case production costs won't be limited to just promotion, printing and distribution.

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Steve Lieber
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Posted: 17 March 2007 at 11:54pm | IP Logged | 10  

Another look at the state of the industry, this time through the lens of a new but increasingly prominent publisher:

http://www.silverbulletcomics.com/news/story.php?a=4317


Edited by Steve Lieber on 17 March 2007 at 11:54pm
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John Griggs Jr
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Posted: 04 April 2007 at 10:15am | IP Logged | 11  

I hope it does better and better. I hope it survives and thrives. I suspect it's currently growing only because the disposable incomes of the late twenty to forty year old readership is increasing. For example, fifteen or twenty years ago almost none of us would be able to afford a John Byrne commission.

///////////////////////////////

I agree!!
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Oliver Staley
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Posted: 04 April 2007 at 3:09pm | IP Logged | 12  

Derek, it's trades for me too now.  Good or bad, you get more for your money that way, and that's what they are writing for now.  Look at JLA, for example.  It will read so much better as a trade.  It's a shame (on them), yes, but it is what it is.

Isn't there something intrinsic to the comic experience that's missing in trades? I think the suspense and anticipation of waiting a month (and I guess we hope it's just a month) was a big part of the fun when I was a kid. Now, I can burn through a TPB in 20-30 minutes and it's seems somehow less filling than reading monthly books. Financially, of course, trades make more sense. They're also more durable, the line up on shelves better and you dont have to worrry about missing an issue. But they're not as much fun.

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