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Michael Casselman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 14 January 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 1266
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| Posted: 29 March 2008 at 7:15pm | IP Logged | 1
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sensibeeeeeeeities
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I'll thank you to keep your nose out of my beeeeeeeities. :-P
Just curious how someone could attribute a pattern of anti-Obamaism based on one post, unless we've got a bunch of mindreaders on hee-yah.
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David Ferguson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 March 2007
Location: Ireland
Posts: 6782
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| Posted: 29 March 2008 at 7:36pm | IP Logged | 2
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What has Dubya done to "trod"over the Irish Constitution? He's treated the
American one like toilet tissue, but I did not realize he'd affected the Irish
constitution!
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Using our airport's for re-fueling military aircraft (the Irish government has allowed this) which is technically destroying our neutrality.
The big thing is the rendition flights that he's promised don't come through Ireland. Of course, if gardai (Irish police) were to try and search a US flight to check, they'd be shot. We, like the Irish government, have to accept that he's telling the truth.
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Geoff Gibson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5744
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| Posted: 29 March 2008 at 7:54pm | IP Logged | 3
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Kevin:
I've watched the entire Wright speech. I take real issue with anyone who
says our government "supports state sponsored terrorism against
palestine and palestinians." Wright says those words at around the five
minute mark of the speech in question. If he believes that Israel engages
in "state sponsored terrorism," I take that to mean on some level Wright
does not believe that Israel has a right to exist and protect itself. That
seems just slightly Anti-Semetic to me, and is offensive. Senator Obama
referenced that himself and also found offense in those thoughts.
I like Obama. I think he's a good man, go back earlier in this thread and
see what I said in the wake of the "More Perfect Union" speech. If you are
defending Obama I am right there with you -- but I don't get your
defense of Wright.
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Geoff Gibson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5744
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| Posted: 29 March 2008 at 7:56pm | IP Logged | 4
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David:
Does Eire allow the military of other governments to refuel? I'll display my
ignorance here (as if I haven't done that enough already!) -- what are
"rendition flights?"
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David Ferguson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 March 2007
Location: Ireland
Posts: 6782
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| Posted: 29 March 2008 at 8:11pm | IP Logged | 5
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Does Eire allow the military of other governments to refuel?
********
Not that I'm aware of.
I'll display my ignorance here (as if I haven't done that enough already!) -- what are "rendition flights?"
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Transferring suspected terrorists to countries known to employ harsh interrogation techniques that may rise to the level of torture.
Under Irish law, it is illegal to carry guns anywhere except the hold.
You can list the constitutions that's he's walked all over: Poland, Slovenia, Iraq...
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Kevin Brown
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 May 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 9126
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| Posted: 29 March 2008 at 8:51pm | IP Logged | 6
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Just curious how someone could attribute a pattern of anti-Obamaism based on one post
**********************
When you say the following: If this is the best counter-argument that die-hard Obama apologists can come up with, it's going to start to look like they aren't even trying.
Your "anti-Obamaism" is quite revealing.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
If you are defending Obama I am right there with you -- but I don't get your
defense of Wright.
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I'm only "defending" Wright to the point of people need to know all of what he said. If they're going to condemn the man, have ALL the facts first. Personally, I did have major problems with what he said, but I at least heard and saw the entire sermon before basing a judgment. I didn't leave it for the media to decide for me.
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Kevin Brown
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 May 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 9126
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| Posted: 29 March 2008 at 8:57pm | IP Logged | 7
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So, now it's not just blacks we're afraid of -- now it's people on the street that we don't know. Gosh... I don't know how we make it through the day -- being surrounded by all those strangers -- saying the wrong thing to them -- 'ridiculing' them...
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One thing I want to say about the above: If you say you've gone through life and never experienced a momentary pause from being scared or concerned for your safety because of a group of people, especially when you're alone, then you're the only one. Everyone has experienced that in their life. Whether you're a kid or an adult. That's how prejudices are born.....
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Mike O'Brien
Byrne Robotics Member
Official JB Historian
Joined: 18 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 10927
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| Posted: 30 March 2008 at 12:36am | IP Logged | 8
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Oh, come on, now, David - no time for neutrality! Ireland must join our coalition of the willing! Don't you want to be like Uzbekistan? Sure, sure, they boil their own citizens in oil, but they're fighting for... uh... WMDs? Sadaam's role in... 9/11? Freedom for... what the hell are they fighting for again?
Never mind - keep Ireland neutral, David. For now anyway - I'm not anti-war, I'm anti-needless-war.
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Knut Robert Knutsen
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Joined: 22 September 2006
Posts: 7369
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| Posted: 30 March 2008 at 2:58am | IP Logged | 9
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"Using our airport's for re-fueling military aircraft (the Irish government has allowed this) which is technically destroying our neutrality.
The big thing is the rendition flights that he's promised don't come through Ireland. Of course, if gardai (Irish police) were to try and search a US flight to check, they'd be shot. We, like the Irish government, have to accept that he's telling the truth."
We've had that problem, too. Obviously the rendition flights must refuel on some Shield-like Helicarrier stationed in the skies over Europe, because those flights need to refuel, but the US apparently swears it doesn't happen in any European country.
I hate that the US actions that are "officially" unacceptable to us are nevertheless somehow tacitly condoned or supported by our governments or our military. Not because they secretly agree, but because they don't want to rock the boat.
It's like European leaders are laying back, closing their eyes and pretending to be somewhere else while they pray for Dubya's presidency and his policies to be over.
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Christopher Alan Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 26 October 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 2787
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| Posted: 30 March 2008 at 3:54am | IP Logged | 10
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Where in the Irish constitution does it mention neutrality?
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David Ferguson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 March 2007
Location: Ireland
Posts: 6782
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| Posted: 30 March 2008 at 5:57am | IP Logged | 11
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Article 29
1. Ireland affirms its devotion to the ideal of peace and friendly co-operation amongst nations founded on international justice and morality.
2. Ireland affirms its adherence to the principle of the pacific settlement of international disputes by international arbitration or judicial determination.
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Christopher Alan Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 26 October 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 2787
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| Posted: 30 March 2008 at 6:27am | IP Logged | 12
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That's not a statement of neutrality and I'm sure the Irish soldiers killed in peacekeeping missions would agree.
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