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Christopher Alan Miller
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Joined: 26 October 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 2787
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| Posted: 10 September 2008 at 10:19pm | IP Logged | 1
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"John McCain likes to say that he'll follow bin Laden to the Gates of Hell, but he won't even go to the cave where he lives."
Sure sounds like he's saying McCain won't go after Bin Laden.
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Kevin Brown
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Joined: 31 May 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 9110
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| Posted: 10 September 2008 at 10:19pm | IP Logged | 2
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I believe the difference is that McCain (according to Oberlman) is saying that he knows HOW to get Bin Laden, and Obama says that we SHOULD make getting Bin Laden a priority. There IS a difference.
Howard
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Exactly.
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Jason Czeskleba
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Joined: 30 April 2004
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| Posted: 10 September 2008 at 10:20pm | IP Logged | 3
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It's been years since I listened to Limbaugh on a regular basis, but my sense was always that he takes himself pretty seriously, in the sense that he feels he is doing important work and conveying an important message. He may use silliness and jokes at times to convey the message, but I think he views his mission more as advocacy than entertainment. Or maybe he feels his mission is BOTH advocacy and entertainment.
I certainly wouldn't liken him to Stewart, who has no goal other than to get laughs. Stewart certainly leans left, but he's quite willing to make jokes at the Democrats' expense too. When Franken was on the radio, I'd say he was the closest thing to a leftist counterpart for Limbaugh.
Edited by Jason Czeskleba on 10 September 2008 at 10:40pm
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Keith Elder
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Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 1973
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| Posted: 10 September 2008 at 10:23pm | IP Logged | 4
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Jason: Franken probably is a better counterpart to Limbaugh. John Stewart... hmm... maybe Dennis Miller is his evil twin (or vice versa)?
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Jason Czeskleba
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Joined: 30 April 2004
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| Posted: 10 September 2008 at 10:28pm | IP Logged | 5
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Christopher Alan Miller wrote:
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"John McCain likes to say that he'll follow bin Laden to the Gates of Hell, but he won't even go to the cave where he lives." Sure sounds like he's saying McCain won't go after Bin Laden. |
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Fair enough. I read that quote more as a criticism of the lack of follow-through by Bush in pursuing Bin Laden, coupled with Obama's ongoing theme that Bush and McCain are the same person. But I acknowledge it can also be taken as saying McCain lacks the will to catch Bin Laden or even that he does not intend to. But as to the rest of it, I still don't think Obama has said anything as extreme as guaranteeing he will catch Bin Laden, or implying he's the only one with the knowledge or ability to do it.
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Jeff Gillmer
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Joined: 30 August 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 1920
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| Posted: 10 September 2008 at 10:31pm | IP Logged | 6
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"Jesus was a community organizer. Pontius Pilate was a govenor."
And how well did that work out for Jesus in the end?
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Jason Czeskleba
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Joined: 30 April 2004
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| Posted: 10 September 2008 at 10:37pm | IP Logged | 7
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Keith Elder wrote:
| Jason: Franken probably is a better counterpart to Limbaugh. John
Stewart... hmm... maybe Dennis Miller is his evil twin (or vice versa)? |
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Again, trouble is there are very few (if any) left-leaning comedians who refuse to make jokes about their own side. They may make more jokes about the Republicans, but they will mock Democrats too. Whereas Miller only makes jokes about liberals/leftists/Democrats. He's on record as saying he will never tell a joke about President Bush, for example. I don't think Stewart would put any person or topic off-limits for purely political reasons like that. Right-wing comedians seem to be much more strict in their partisanship than left-wing comedians. I can't think of anyone who is a true equivalent to Dennis Miller in this regard.
Same thing with comic strips. Doonesbury is perceived as left-wing, but also makes lots of jokes about the left and Democrats. On the right they've got Mallard Fillmore.
Edited by Jason Czeskleba on 10 September 2008 at 10:41pm
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Mike O'Brien
Byrne Robotics Member
Official JB Historian
Joined: 18 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 10927
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| Posted: 10 September 2008 at 11:02pm | IP Logged | 8
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I agree with Jason - it's refreshing to see a blow-hard on our side for a change.
Here's the other thing - you can stand back and hold your nose and say "they're all blow-hards", but here's the clincher for me - this appeals to a certain aspect of my personality that I've mentioned before in this very thread - I am a huge fan of the underdog, and on the same hand, have no sympathy for those in power or who have authority or wealth.
Blow-hards on the right are blowing hot air about helping the rich and big business and authority figures, while blow-hards on the left are yelling about the poor and the little guy and the working class.
So, no, I have no problem with the likes of Keith Olberman.
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Mike O'Brien
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Posts: 10927
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| Posted: 10 September 2008 at 11:09pm | IP Logged | 9
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Oh, but let me add - I don't need to have some blow-hard to identify with, but as long as the right get blow-hards, I don't see why the left shouldn't have them, too.
Plus? Music radio is deader than Sarah Pailin's soul, so I only listen to talk radio - and in any given market the right wing talk radio outnumbers the left at least two to one, if not more - I live in an area now where it's only right wing radio (not counting NPR which is not safe to listen to while driving) - so, again, if I'm going to hear some lunatic rant....
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Joe Zhang
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Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12843
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| Posted: 10 September 2008 at 11:19pm | IP Logged | 10
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Olberman's main point, that the Republicans are using terror to get McCain elected, is not partisan. In fact, even the most hardened, cynical Republican should take heed. What if fear of terrorism turns into the best way to win elections? It leads us into a perverse world where the political survival of the Right would depend on the existence of Muslim terrorists. There would be an interest in never solving the underlying causes of terrorism.
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Valerie Finnigan
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Joined: 27 March 2006
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| Posted: 10 September 2008 at 11:45pm | IP Logged | 11
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It leads us into a perverse world where the political survival of the
Right would depend on the existence of Muslim terrorists. There would
be an interest in never solving the underlying causes of terrorism.
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That is a hazard of any group defining itself by what it opposes. We solve terrorism. How are the Republicans going to keep voters? I've had pretty much the same idea about the abortion issue. Once elective abortion is outlawed, the "liberal" demand for adequate family benefits, health care reform, equal rights for women, even those who don't have abortions, et cetera will become way too loud to be ignored. The consistently pro-life will show their liberal colors and join in that clamor (some already have), while others will consider their job done, and the Republicans will lose a significant means of attracting and energizing voters without any elective abortions to oppose.
On the other side, I've seen too many fellow Dems say, "Anyone but Bush." So we get Bush out of office. Then what?
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Gene Best
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Joined: 24 October 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 4598
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| Posted: 11 September 2008 at 12:01am | IP Logged | 12
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Very insightful, Valerie.
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