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Mike O'Brien Byrne Robotics Member
Official JB Historian
Joined: 18 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 10927
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| Posted: 11 March 2008 at 11:07am | IP Logged | 1
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I would have never pegged William as a Bill Clinton supporter! Interesting.
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David Ferguson Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 17 March 2007 Location: Ireland Posts: 6782
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| Posted: 11 March 2008 at 2:04pm | IP Logged | 2
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I would have never pegged William as a Bill Clinton supporter! Interesting.
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I wouldn't have pegged Stan Lee. Heard about this?
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Thom Price Byrne Robotics Member
LHomme Diabolique
Joined: 29 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 7592
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| Posted: 11 March 2008 at 5:41pm | IP Logged | 3
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Look at it this way, if I'm going into surgery, I don't want the wife of the surgeon to perform the surgery.... No matter how long she's been married to him.
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A terrible analogy. Surgery is a obviously a hands-on skill which cannot be learned just through exposure. On the other hand, I sat next to a salesperson at my previous job for 3 years, and although I was never directly involved in the sales process I learned a lot just from sitting near him and listening But to use your analogy, if said wife spent 8 years at his office and accompanied him to surgery, I certainly wouldn't mind asking her some general medical advice.
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Mike O'Brien Byrne Robotics Member
Official JB Historian
Joined: 18 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 10927
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| Posted: 11 March 2008 at 5:44pm | IP Logged | 4
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I had, David! I don't know if we can say that Stan's a supporter or not - I get the feeling that Stan will work any room, and make anyone feel special - he's got a gift for that - I'm guessing he'd say the same with a lot of politicians. But maybe I'm wrong.
Having said that, yes, that story does shed some light on the types of people the Clintons will take money from, doesn't it?
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Kevin Brown Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 31 May 2005 Location: United States Posts: 9126
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| Posted: 11 March 2008 at 6:10pm | IP Logged | 5
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And if, just for the sake of argument, they're both surgeons, and it's widely known (or at least assumed) that she's consulted on many of his patients in the past?
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But in this case, with Hillary, she's not a life long politician like Bill. She spent a life in politics, yes, but not like him. So they may have both been in the same field, their levels of expertise are considerably different and what they each did with their "jobs" are different.
The same would go for a surgeon.
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A terrible analogy. Surgery is a obviously a hands-on skill which cannot be learned just through exposure. On the other hand, I sat next to a salesperson at my previous job for 3 years, and although I was never directly involved in the sales process I learned a lot just from sitting near him and listening But to use your analogy, if said wife spent 8 years at his office and accompanied him to surgery, I certainly wouldn't mind asking her some general medical advice.
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Advice? Wouldn't bother me. So by all means allow Hillary Clinton to supply allllll the advice she want's to supply.
And the analogy is an extreme, but it still makes the point. She may have "learned" by sitting at her husband's side, that doesn't make her the President he was or even capable of running the country. It just means she has a bit more "inside info". Nothing more, nothing less.
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Jason Czeskleba Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 30 April 2004 Posts: 4638
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| Posted: 11 March 2008 at 7:17pm | IP Logged | 6
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I think it's fair to say that being an advisor to the President provides some relevant experience toward being President. But I think Hillary is trying to make much more out of this experience than is warranted. In terms of experiential learning, I'd say that holding elected office and working on legislation is much more relevant experience than being a political advisor. Though I don't think cumulative years of experience is the single most important factor to look for anyway, Obama actually has more years experience as an elected legislator than Clinton does. I hope he starts challenging her more on this issue. Polls show that most Americans believe she is "more experienced" simply because she says it all the time.
As I said before, Hillary Clinton's strategy is very shortsighted. If she is able to win the nomination by convincing voters that experience is the single most important quality to look for in a candidate, then John McCain is going to rip her to shreds in the general election on that issue. Her ridiculous claims of "35 years of experience" will be popped like a balloon. I can see a "swift boat" type commercial now: "Hey, did Bill Clinton ever talk politics with Monica Lewinsky? Maybe she's qualified to be President too because of her experience."
I can't believe any Democrats think Hillary Clinton has a shot at winning the general election.
Edited by Jason Czeskleba on 11 March 2008 at 7:23pm
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Knut Robert Knutsen Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 22 September 2006 Posts: 7369
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| Posted: 11 March 2008 at 11:31pm | IP Logged | 7
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I see in the press now the "he only gets a pass on his inexperience because he's black" argument is being used by prominent Clinton supporters. That's bad. I think that'll hurt Hilary.
He's more eloquent than Hilary, more level-headed, more emotionally accessible, more inclusive and uniting, he is more inspiring, he brings new voters to the party and he has more legislative experience than Hilary (although most of it on the state level). If her claim to experience boils down to "Life with Bill", she may have learned a lot, but she also got screwed (figuratively) repeatedly and kept coming back for more. That's not a presidential quality.
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William McCormick Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 26 February 2006 Posts: 3297
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| Posted: 12 March 2008 at 6:08am | IP Logged | 8
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Which BILL Clinton did, not Hillary. Being married to him does not give her the same intelligence, qualities, or abilities.
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I never said it did. I was responding directly at Neil Lindholm's post about why we wouldn't want Hillary as President and managing to slam the job Bill did during his 8 years as same. Blow jobs aside.
I'd much rather have the 8 years of that type of foolishness than what Bush has put the country through in his.
Having said that I'm an Obama supporter in this election.
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Neil Lindholm Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 12 January 2005 Location: China Posts: 4943
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| Posted: 12 March 2008 at 7:16am | IP Logged | 9
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When I said that the US (and by extension, the world) does not need more years of Clinton, I meant that the politics of old, the scandals, the drama, the impeachments, etc. I am not impressed with the Clinton's sad attacks on Obama (anyone read this? Comparing the 3am commercial to scenes from "Birth of a Nation". If true, they are at a new low), and releasing the pictures of Obama in African garb. I saw a show on TV where they were asking people on the street how they felt that Obama's middle name is Hussain, and people were not going to vote for him because he might be Muslim.
This is the kind of crap I was talking about, the fear-mongering and politics as usual. I would vote for Obama if I was American and everybody over here at the school agrees and are amazed that people actually choose Clinton over Obama, for the same reasons.
Of course, anything would be better than the Bush regime.
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Andrew Hess Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 9847
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| Posted: 12 March 2008 at 7:46am | IP Logged | 10
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Sorry, Bob (& Kevin) but I gotta disagree about Clinton having little (or
nothing) to do with the economy of the 90s. Balancing the budget and
stopping the record deficits (until the latest presidency) of the 80s were no
mean feat.
You're saying that this would have happened any way? I sure didn't see that
trend thru the 80s or early 90s.
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William McCormick Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 26 February 2006 Posts: 3297
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| Posted: 12 March 2008 at 8:45am | IP Logged | 11
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When I said that the US (and by extension, the world) does not need more years of Clinton, I meant that the politics of old, the scandals, the drama, the impeachments, etc. I am not impressed with the Clinton's sad attacks on Obama (anyone read this? Comparing the 3am commercial to scenes from "Birth of a Nation". If true, they are at a new low), and releasing the pictures of Obama in African garb. I saw a show on TV where they were asking people on the street how they felt that Obama's middle name is Hussain, and people were not going to vote for him because he might be Muslim.
This is the kind of crap I was talking about, the fear-mongering and politics as usual. I would vote for Obama if I was American and everybody over here at the school agrees and are amazed that people actually choose Clinton over Obama, for the same reasons.
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I absolutely agree, Neil. But all the drama that went on during the Clinton presidency doesn't change the fact that there was good done during his tenure. And as you stated, anything is better than Bush. The point I was making in my usual ham fisted way.
I like Obama for many reasons. But he just seems the most real to me. I wouldn't vote for McCain under any circumstances so I'm glad someone may be running against him that I wouldn't feel I was wasting a vote for. That is how I would feel if voting for Hillary.
However, if it was between her and McCain, I would definitely vote for Hillary. Lesser of two evils and all.
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Kevin Brown Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 31 May 2005 Location: United States Posts: 9126
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| Posted: 12 March 2008 at 8:53am | IP Logged | 12
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I see in the press now the "he only gets a pass on his inexperience because he's black" argument is being used by prominent Clinton supporters. That's bad. I think that'll hurt Hilary.
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Only once she gets past PA. I don't think anything can really hurt her right now in the short term, unfortunately. But a few more such comments like the one Ferraro pulled out, it'll torpedo Clinton's campaign.
In some of the news items I've read today, it seems that a few super delegates (who have yet to formally commit) are now leaning towards Obama because such comments keep coming out of her campign. So that'll be interesting to see how it all plays out.
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