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Topic: Big Watchmen write-up in EW (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post ReplyPost New Topic
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James C. Taylor
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Posted: 26 October 2005 at 11:12am | IP Logged | 1  

This just handed to me: Not everyone in the world has the same taste as Francis Grey. We now return you to the thread.
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Mike Murray
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Posted: 26 October 2005 at 11:54am | IP Logged | 2  

Interesting - it seems to be a popular view round these parts that Marvel should make more use of fill-in artists.  That if Hitch can't produce 12 issues a year on The Ultimates, for example, Marvel should refuse to skip a month's solicitations but rather bring in a fill-in team.  When it was pointed out that they aren't technically late, there were still many posters saying that Marvel is making a mistake in selling 8 issues a year with a consistant creative team instead of 12 with fill-ins mixed in.

But here, many years after Squadon Supreme was completed with a varied art team, we have folks saying that inconsistancy hurts their enjoyment of the book.  In retrospect, perhaps Marvel should have make sure of the art consistancy, monthly schedule be damned?  Short-term monthly sales might have been sacrificed but perhaps readers 10 years or more later - or even in future generations, 20 years from now - would consider SS a more seminal, can't miss work and who knows how many more future printings the book might have enjoyed?  I'm sure it will remain in print, but could it be that making those monthly deadlines cost untold thousands of dollars (and a fair amount of prestidge) in the long run?

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John Mietus
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Posted: 26 October 2005 at 11:58am | IP Logged | 3  

No, what's being said is that miniseries should be completed by a team
before they're even solicited so that they can then be released on a regular
schedule. Since they're limited series, they have that luxury. It's when
the marketing departments come in and say, "No, let's schedule the first
issue to be out last month" that things get fucked up.

Big difference between limited series and ongoing series.
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Jason Schulman
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Posted: 26 October 2005 at 12:01pm | IP Logged | 4  

Is this why Brian Bolland has never done the art (covers aside) for a series since Camelot 3000?
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Joe Mayer
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Posted: 26 October 2005 at 12:05pm | IP Logged | 5  

But if a company markets a specific number of issues for an ongoing series under a specific creative team, shouldn't it stick to that creative team?
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Bill Lukash
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Posted: 26 October 2005 at 12:11pm | IP Logged | 6  

Squardron Supreme and Watchmen are two different types of stories and I really don't think its an apples to apples argument.  SS is about super-heroes that 'suddenly' realize they have the ability to change the world, and how they do it.  Watchmen is more like 'what if super-heroes were real.' 

I think you could probably compare the new Squadron Supreme to the Watchmen, but not the old one.  I like the old SS and Watchmen a great deal, and I can't pick a favorite.

All IMO, of course.
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Mike Murray
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Posted: 26 October 2005 at 12:11pm | IP Logged | 7  

"Big difference between limited series and ongoing series."

What's the difference between Squadron Supreme is and Ultimates Vol 2?  They're both 12-issue stories that will sell as collected editions for years after anyone remembers whether the individual issues came out on time.  Thank God Marvel isn't using fill-in artists on Ultimates, I believe that there is something to be said for maintaining a creative consistancy and I believe the comments in this thread show evidence that SS's standing in the field has been diminished because of inconsistant art.

Who pays for the creative team to work for a year (or more) getting 12 issues "in the can" before any sales are realized?  That sounds expensive, I'm not surprised it's not commonplace.

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John Byrne
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Posted: 26 October 2005 at 12:20pm | IP Logged | 8  

But if a company markets a specific number of issues for an ongoing series under a specific creative team, shouldn't it stick to that creative team?

******

And right there you underscore what is really the root problem: it's become about the singer, not the song.

When I was a lad, the only promotion Marvel or DC did for upcoming books was house ads the month the books came out. And what those ads sold was AMAZING SPIDER-MAN, or FANTASTIC FOUR, or X-MEN, or AVENGERS -- not Stan Lee, or Steve Ditko, or Jack Kirby, or anyone else. DC was the same. The ads sold the books, not the people working on them.

If, indeed, the industry has become all about the Who rather than the What, then the way things work, with books being later and later because we are "growing roses" is the true shape of the future, and we are going to see more of it, not less, as more and more artists and writers coast on their name appeal and nothing akin to professionalism.

But keep this in mind, those of you who think this would not be such a bad thing: that's how you run a fan club, not a publishing operation. If you want comics to become even more isolated, and inaccessible and even more aimed at smaller and smaller clutches of fans ---- well, fine. Have fun. But don't expect to be in for the long run. There ain't gonna be one.

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Steve Horton
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Posted: 26 October 2005 at 12:25pm | IP Logged | 9  

That's one thing that TV shows and movies do right in this respect. Other than a few isolated examples, nobody cares about the director of a movie or TV show (ESPECIALLY television). It's about the characters and the plot.
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Steve Horton
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Posted: 26 October 2005 at 12:31pm | IP Logged | 10  

The JLA are out-Watchmen-ing the Watchmen characters these days. I'd like to see someone draw a comic that shows the Justice League brainwashing and breaking villain's necks and the Watchmen characters standing off to the side, looking disgusted.

 

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Mike Murray
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Posted: 26 October 2005 at 12:32pm | IP Logged | 11  

"It's about the characters and the plot. "

In other words, it's about the writer(s).  People may not know the writer's names, but they know what they like, and aren't going to keep tuning in just because the show gets aired on time every week.

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Jon Juzan
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Posted: 26 October 2005 at 12:35pm | IP Logged | 12  

If you want comics to become even more isolated, and inaccessible and even more aimed at smaller and smaller clutches of fans ---- well, fine. Have fun. But don't expect to be in for the long run. There ain't gonna be one.
------------------------------------------------------------ --------------------------
I'd say the music industry has more than its share of being about "the singer, not the song."  And TOTALLY disagree with Steve about movies and TV shows.  How many people went to see movies in the 80's because Spielberg's name was slapped on them. How has that hurt either industry or made them smaller?




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