You're coming across as incredibly ignorant and...well...like a bitter old crank.

The funny thing is that Astro Boy is probably right up your street.

Yah. I should try it. I see Dark Horse has some stuff and I always mean to check it out.

Well, I imagine Ultraman's been going since at least the late 60s, and he became an icon to ME when I was a kid (five or six) watching Ultraman and the last episode he died in order to save Earth, really died, and I was so shocked and hurt I couldn't even speak for the crying. Never got over it. And Ultraman's gigantic all right, in Japan at least and cultishly here.

Still, I don't compare Ultraman to universal icons like Superman. It's pointless. The impact of Ultraman was personal, while Superman's is cultural, ingrained in the American psyche for all time. He needs to be treated with respect by creators who care, and luckily Byrne's on the case. So even if Astro Boy is incredible, it doesn't match up. In Japan he might, but Japan was never known for it's acceptance of anything outside their culture anyway. It might be an interesting experiment to see if classic Superman makes as big an impact as Astro Boy with children in Japan reading both. (Byrne's Supes anyway, the only one I ever completely dug.)

If you really dug Byrne's Superman, you wouldn't call him "Supes" :)

Yes, manga have icons. And it's incredible to see that every boy and girl in Japan know them because they've followed the manga and the anime.

Dragon Ball, Hokuto no Ken, Tiger Mask, City Hunter... Every Japanese knows them. And I'm talking about series concluded 10, 20 or 30 years ago.

Of course, I are really doubtful that these characters could be compared to Superman, Batman or Spider-Man. Everyone can recognize an icon, and I don't think that my dad could say "This is Kenshiro or Son Goku".

Lots of people who recognize Superman as an "icon" never read a Superman comic on their lives, they know the character from the cartoons or movies. On the other hand, manga's top characters like Astro Boy, Cyborg 009 and Sazae-san are usually known because of their comics, which were read by large segments of japaneses society on thier time and are still readily avaliable on any japanese bookstore (much like Tintin - which predates Superman by 10 years, BTW - and Asterix in Europe).

For the comic industry (the point of this discussion), this is the important thing.

"For the comic industry (the point of this discussion), this is the important thing."

What's the point in HAVING an Industry if it produces crap, Mango or not? You're saying it's better to have ANY kind of Industry, which is getting worse and producing worse, barring the independent stuff or the caring creator, both of which are the exception now, not the rule? So a healthy shite Industry is better than a healthy comic book producing Industry? I mean comics that will sell because they've great art and writing and concern readily identifiable icons and can be almost fallen over while you're going to get your Ranch Flavored Doritos. How can I be that wrong about this? Is everything so changed that it is no longer remotely viable to say that comic books in America as we remember them are, as I think in my worst moments, a complete anachronism? This current craptastic trend in comics quality is the "wave of the future, get used to it"? How sickening.

And don't cite the exceptions, I already got that. I KNOW there's excellent comics being produced, better than they ever have been. For anybody over 14 or 15, this is absolutely true. Any younger, NO way.

On a lighter note, I apologize for denigrating Byrne's Superman with SUPES. I'd never SAY it aloud.

but Japan was never known for it's acceptance of anything outside their culture anyway.

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I thought the knock on japan was that for the last few decades, they've been adopting other cultures, especially American, at a feverish pace.