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Steve Lieber
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 July 2004
Posts: 295
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| Posted: 28 August 2005 at 7:39pm | IP Logged | 1
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Joe, who's cedeing anything? There are plenty of successful all-ages
comics by by American pros. Is Jeff Smith Japanese? Jay Hosler lives in
Pennsylvania. Andy Runyon is in Georgia. The Archie people are
mostly around NYC. Spiegelman's Little Lit crew is mostly Americans.
Dav Pilkey, whose 8 "Captain Underpants" comics have sold 3 million
copies each, lives about an hour from me here in Oregon. He's one of
the top authors in the English language. He doesn't count? The
cartoonists that Nicholodeon publishes are a bunch of East Coasters.
Ditto for Mad. The names that Scholastic are signing are almost all
homegrown. DC's got a great Cartoon network line. Bongo's doing
Simpsons. Mark Crilley's built an audience with Akiko. Where do you get
the idea that American comics pros are not doing all-ages comics?
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Mary Ives
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 August 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 206
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| Posted: 28 August 2005 at 7:43pm | IP Logged | 2
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Mike, this may or may not be a response directly to your post, but I
believe the system will spit it out that way. In either case, please
consider it supportive of your stand/ideas/er....stuff...
I'm a relatively new entry to the comic field in general (and I'm
tossing EVERYTHING into that basket, GN, Manga, Monthlies, et
al). Until I started meeting people on various forums
(WFE/Kbox/etc), I never KNEW anybody who read comics in any form (I'm
43). EVER. And not just because I'm a girl - I've checked with my
male buddies from HS and they draw the same blank.
So, I was naturally curious (hey, if it involves reading anything in
print, tell me about it) after hearing about everybody talking about
comics. Someone finally sensed my curiousity and thought I'd be
interested in trying something, but knew I had no idea where to
start...so one of the guys on the WFE sent me his copy of Sandman:
Preludes and Nocturnes...and after getting used to the idea of
pictures/text (hey, wow, the pictures MEAN something), I was hooked.
I've branched out a bit into some Manga and some other 'graphic
novels' and I absolutely adore Gold Digger; I love Priest, which
is Manga. I tried to pick up my first monthly, 1602, which, while I
loved the artwork and thought I'd like the writing because it was
Gaiman, I found out that in order to get any fun out of it, I had to
understand all sorts of continuity references from other series...and
that turned me off of it.
Urk, point is...I know that as a relatively new reader, I have not
ventured into Super Hero comics. Not because I 'look down' on them nor
because I wouldn't like them (I allow the possibility of finding a good
superhero comic that I'd adore), but because the whole darn field is
intimidating....picking up any superhero comic is like turning on a tv
soap opera (in terms of continuity and cross-plots, etc) that's been
running for 20 years.
It's not very condusive for someone to pick up a comic for the very
first time and not understand references and cross-references from all
over the map - it's intimidating.
I think that the industry does need to attract younger readers for the
future, but speaking as a relatively new older reader, the movies (bad
or good) from comics and/or graphic novels are getting my friends
interested...I've had a half dozen friends who know that I read comics
now ask me about getting them copies of the originals of everything
from FF to Sin City. And these are people I've never even seen
pick up a book before.
So, whilst I can't judge how some sectors/niches are doing, I know that
people don't snicker when they see me with a copy of Artesia or
Hellsing or Gold Digger any more...
And if someone can suggest a good superhero comic that doesn't require
a Master's Degree in continuity, I'd be more than willing to try it.
My 2cents worth. *grin*
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Eric Kleefeld
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 December 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4422
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| Posted: 28 August 2005 at 7:51pm | IP Logged | 3
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Just what are current comics sales? If we added together manga sales in
mainstream venues, the Scholastic stuff and the DSM (probably way behind),
what's the overall sales picture? What shape is the medium really in as far as
this country is concerned?
The American superhero comic may very well be dying, though I do not
believe it was inevitable. But there is also a future for comics if the right
decisions can get made from here.
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John Mietus
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 9704
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| Posted: 28 August 2005 at 7:59pm | IP Logged | 4
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Mary, if John Byrne writes it, you can be assured that you won't need to
read anything other than that comic to understand the gist of what's
going on.
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David Blot
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 August 2005
Location: France
Posts: 858
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| Posted: 28 August 2005 at 8:06pm | IP Logged | 5
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Hello Mary. Can we ask you how you knew this forum or JB since you dont
read super hero comic book :)
Concerning continuiting free super hero to recommend, I'll think all our
us gentlemen will surely answer you asap, just give us some times to
think about it.
Otherwise, I do have to admit that from all the friends I have in the US
(mostly NYC & Chicago) NONE of them read comics. Half of my french
friend read them at leat time to time. That's impressive, but... being the
optimistic one...
.... That only means for me that US comic book market didnt reach his full
potential... yet.
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David Blot
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 August 2005
Location: France
Posts: 858
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| Posted: 28 August 2005 at 8:11pm | IP Logged | 6
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Continuity free super hero book to try ?
Since it's JB's forum, I have to say MAN OF STEEL 6 issues limited series
done by John in 1987 redifining Superman. Of course it is in TPB.
Otherwise, if you're more Baman. BATMAN YEAR ONE by Frank Miller &
David Mazzuchelli does the same job of telling it from zero for the Dark
Knight. A beautiful hardcover was just issued that reprint all the mini.
Then... If you love Miller & Mazzuchelli : DARDEVIL BORN AGAIN. Wow.
That one is huge. And, now you dont need that much continuity to enjoy
it.
Whish I was lucky to discover them now... :)
Now we want reviews !
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Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
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| Posted: 28 August 2005 at 8:14pm | IP Logged | 7
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"There are plenty of successful all-ages
comics by by American pros"
Are they doing just as well or better than Manga here?
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Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
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| Posted: 28 August 2005 at 8:23pm | IP Logged | 8
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" It's a global community, and loyalty to the nation-state is a
relic of the 20th century."
Well thanks for letting us know you stand for absolutely nothing.
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Rob Hewitt
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 11 May 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 10182
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| Posted: 28 August 2005 at 8:25pm | IP Logged | 9
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I was going to go there Joe, but i thought better of it. Didn;t want to start another argument.
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Andy Hardy
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 441
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| Posted: 28 August 2005 at 8:39pm | IP Logged | 10
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Mary: For current, almost continuity-free stuff, I'd suggest (and forgive me for not always mentioning the artists' names):
- Doom Patrol by John Byrne
- Blood of the Demon by John Byrne
- Spider-Man/Human Torch by Dan Slott (which is in a TPB now)
- She-Hulk by Dan Slott (which is in two TPBs now)
- Marvel Team-Up by Robert Kirkman
- Plastic Man by Kyle Baker (much more human than action, though)
- Green Lantern (currently on issue 3) by Geoff Johns
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David Blot
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 August 2005
Location: France
Posts: 858
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| Posted: 28 August 2005 at 9:23pm | IP Logged | 11
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It's a global community, and loyalty to the nation-state is a
relic of the 20th century."
Well thanks for letting us know you stand for absolutely nothing.
------
Well it looks like he's standing for global community.
But I dont wanna go there either. Too french for that ;)
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Steve Lieber
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 July 2004
Posts: 295
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| Posted: 28 August 2005 at 9:59pm | IP Logged | 12
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"
Are they doing just as well or better than Manga here?"
I don't have numbers for everyone's books, but some do better, some do
worse. One of the numbers I did cite, 3 million for Dav Pilkey, is
definitely in the "better" column. What matters is that good work is
getting done and the cartoonists who create it are more and more able
to find a publisher or big enough audience to support the creation of
further work. JB's said that the song is more important than the
singer. I think the song is also more important than the record company
distributing it or its position on the top 40.
I also think the quality of a piece of work is more important than the
country it was produced in. Let me put it this way: if something of
American-born me outsold a good translation of something by Lat or
Tezuka or Alberto Breccia or Herge or Hugo Pratt, that wouldn't
be anything for an American comics fan to be happy about, because I'm
not as good as they are.
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Topic Closed)
