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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 133375
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Posted: 24 July 2024 at 12:33pm | IP Logged | 1
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When I was a kid it would sometimes trouble me that everyone in Metropolis—and by extension the world—knew that Superman had a secret identity. When had he been dumb enough to announce that? (Same day he told everybody about kryptonite?)What was going on there was writers getting sloppy—which started early!—and investing the characters with knowledge they, the writers, had, but which logically would not really be shared. It’s all too common. People know of the existence of the Fortress of Solitude and the Batcave. They know about the time limit on Green Lantern’s power ring—and the ring’s yellow weakness! They know about Wonder Woman losing her powers if bound by a man. They know about Jimmy Olsen’s signal watch (kind of defeating its purpose) and that Lois Lane is “Superman’s girlfriend”. There’s less of this at Marvel. Of course everyone knows Spider-Man has a secret identity. He wears a mask! But that’s not the same as a maskless character telling everyone he spends time being somebody else. And remember, the only way people could know that about Superman is if he TOLD them.
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Kevin Brown Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 May 2005 Location: United States Posts: 8968
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Posted: 24 July 2024 at 1:59pm | IP Logged | 2
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There's logic and then there's "comic book logic". "Comic book logic" was rarely, if ever, logical. I know I'm speaking to the choir here, but it was all done to create a false sense of drama that fell flat.
Like you, it did trouble me and often wondered why.
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Michael Penn Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 April 2006 Location: United States Posts: 12726
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Posted: 24 July 2024 at 2:14pm | IP Logged | 3
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It's natural for people in comicbooks to wonder where Superman goes when he's off-duty or where Batman might have a base of operations, etc. But how that understandable speculation somehow leads into superheroes volunteering information that does nothing but compromise their functions doesn't make sense.
Why should any person in the comicbook world wonder if Superman, which is all they ever know and see, completely open and exposed to everybody, might have a secret identity?
The brilliance of Clark Kent is that he's the real man working behind the scenes in a position where he can find out firsthand the worst trouble-spots on earth and then use his Superman character to right wrongs.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 133375
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Posted: 24 July 2024 at 3:47pm | IP Logged | 4
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When working on Superman, I built upon the notion that the citizens of Metropolis, noticing that Superman wasn’t around, would simply assume he was somewhere else. There was really no logical (that word again!) reason for anyone to assume he Walked Among Them in disguise. They’d also have no reason to assume he needed down time.
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Mark Haslett Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 6442
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Posted: 24 July 2024 at 4:05pm | IP Logged | 5
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In “real life” it seems to me your logic is majorly sound.
But it also seems to me how that cat would be impossible to put back in its bag if hints ever got out. If Superman ever intimated, perhaps in an interview with a charming Planet reporter, that it even crossed his mind to “walk among us”— even just to see what it’s like — it would set the world’s imagination on fire with suspicion.
I vastly prefer the secret being kept secret and Superman being assumed to be “on duty” 24/7.
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Michael Penn Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 April 2006 Location: United States Posts: 12726
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Posted: 24 July 2024 at 4:23pm | IP Logged | 6
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An editorial decision could be made at any time to change what comicbook people going forward know about Superman, just ignoring what they used to know: new readers would be introduced to a completely secret secret identity for Superman and old readers would like it or lump it. But I suppose that would never, ever happen.
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ron bailey Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 October 2016 Location: United States Posts: 1041
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Posted: 24 July 2024 at 4:43pm | IP Logged | 7
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If Superman ever intimated, perhaps in an interview ... to “walk among us” ... it would set the world’s imagination on fire with suspicion. ........ Would it? It wouldn't occur to me that he would do so with an ongoing formal identity that could be tracked, just that he would temporarily operate incognito for as long as it suited him then abandon it to go about his super-business as usual.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 133375
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Posted: 24 July 2024 at 4:57pm | IP Logged | 8
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When DC got rid of kryptonite, Jimmy Olsen was given a line that Superman was now only vulnerable to magic, “And that’s rare, real rare!”That was a typical example of editorial dotting all the lower case Js. There was no real reason for Jimmy to make such a comment, since everyone in the room already knew it, but something like “footnote syndrome” demanded a notation. The annoying aspect for me—still years away from actually working on Superman’s titles—was that it reinforced the popular fan misconception that Superman had a special vulnerability to magic, not the same vulnerability EVERYTHING has.
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Mark Haslett Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 6442
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Posted: 24 July 2024 at 5:17pm | IP Logged | 9
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Ron: Would it? It wouldn't occur to me …
*** When I hear crazy conspiracy theories built up and spread like wildfire, I don’t really think it’s people like you starting them— but I do think the “confirmed” idea that Superman may walk among us would take hold pretty fast.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 133375
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Posted: 24 July 2024 at 5:25pm | IP Logged | 10
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If we apply real world rules too restrictively we can imagine some people guessing that Superman has a secret identity, and then shooting random strangers on the street in an effort to prove it. We might even imagine Superman announcing that he was giving up his double identity in order to stop the slaughter.
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Brian ONeill Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 04 July 2024 Posts: 42
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Posted: 24 July 2024 at 5:57pm | IP Logged | 11
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The 'Superman vulnerable to magic' thing was all too often treated like 'Let's cross out the word 'Kryptonite' everywhere it appears, and say 'magic' instead.'At one time, magic did whatever the writers wanted it to do to Superman...sometimes even increasing his powers.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 133375
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Posted: 24 July 2024 at 6:37pm | IP Logged | 12
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Magic CAN do whatever the writer wants. It exists outside the boundaries of physical laws. Which is a good reason to generally avoid it when dealing with Superman!
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