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John Byrne
Robot Wrangler
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 102266
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| Posted: 09 May 2005 at 4:54am | IP Logged | 1
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For an alternative viewpoint:
******
More of an alternative missing of the point.
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John Mietus
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 9704
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| Posted: 09 May 2005 at 5:11am | IP Logged | 2
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I'm reminded of my favorite mixed metaphor from "The Rutles:"
Grabbing the wrong end of the stick and beating about the bush with it.
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Leroy Douresseaux
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 29 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 1657
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| Posted: 09 May 2005 at 5:20am | IP Logged | 3
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No, Brandon didn't miss the point.
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Glenn Brown
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3095
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| Posted: 09 May 2005 at 5:30am | IP Logged | 4
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I didn't think so, either. Here are excerpts from a commentary by writer Steven Grant:
"There is no one man, woman or child in the United States who has been awake at any time since the 1960s (and probably considerably before that) who is not aware of the racist meaning and intent of the n word. The Unabomber knows it. While I'm sure there are those who use it quaintly, at absolute best it can only be used condescendingly...
"If people John knows "use the word... because it's the word they use, not because they imagine it has any negative racial connotations," it's only because they don't imagine the racial connotations to be negative, not because they don't know what the racial connotations are. They know. If they've been living in this country, they know. Which means... they're racists.
"Glad I could clear that up for all our Canadian imports out there..."
Here is the link to the full article for anyone interested:
Edited by Glenn Brown on 09 May 2005 at 5:31am
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John Byrne
Robot Wrangler
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 102266
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| Posted: 09 May 2005 at 5:50am | IP Logged | 5
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"But, I have to say, when he's wrong he's wrong... "******* Okay -- I was wrong. Using a word makes it the correct word. Calling the wheel of a car the "spinny thing" makes "spinny thing" the correct term for describing the wheel of a car. And every racial epithet ever applied to anyone, anywhere, for any reason, is perfectly appropriate. Use makes right. Thanks for setting me straight on that!
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Leroy Douresseaux
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 29 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 1657
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| Posted: 09 May 2005 at 5:58am | IP Logged | 6
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Don't be mad, 'Toine!
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Gary Coleman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 03 May 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 2
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| Posted: 09 May 2005 at 6:04am | IP Logged | 7
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Jacob P Secrest wrote:
Gary Coleman wrote:
John Byrne wrote:
"Um..." in point of fact there are plenty of people who use the word
"nigger" because that is the word they use, not because they imagine it
has any negative racial connotations. That's precisely why I chose that
word as my illustration. |
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All I know is that I'd never heard the term "word bubble" before. But
after reading your incredibly insensitive comments, I've decided to use
this term exclusively and as often as possible! |
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You totally misunderstood JB, he was saying that just because some
people use certain terms that they are right, and then he gave an example
of this in order to emphasize his point, he was in no way supporting
racial slurs, but merely using one as an example of how people using
certain words or terms doesn't make them right. |
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<>As someone who writes for a living, you'd think he'd try to get
his point across better. I'm not the only one who's totally
misinterpreted his meaning, if I even did in the first place.
GC
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John Byrne
Robot Wrangler
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 102266
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| Posted: 09 May 2005 at 6:17am | IP Logged | 8
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Several years ago, in one of his yearly review columns, George WIll mentioned the story of a Black man who bought his son a new computer, replete with a CD-Encyclopedia. Writing a report for school, using this new tool, the son attempted to type in the word "Niger", in a search for information on the river of the same name. He mistyped, adding a second "G". Three "hits" turned up, one of which was (as I recall) use of the word in the title of a poem by a Black author.The father took offense. He sued the maker of the encyclopedia, the maker of the computer, and the store where he had bought the stuff. Don't remember if he won or not, but Will's point in mentioning this bizarre case -- beyond the absurdity that it would even get into court -- was that there is nothing in the Constitution of the United States to protect our "right" not to be offended. I used the word "nigger" up toward the top of this increasingly pointless thread, precisely because it is an emotionally charged word. I might have used "spic", or "wop", or "kike", or "fag", or any of several thousand words to which we have granted extraordinary power in our lives. The point was that using a word does not make it "right". Just as Steve Grant's attempt, above, to turn "Canadian" into a slur does not make it one. Every time we get into a lather over the mere use of a word -- ignoring context -- it means we have given that word power over us. And that means, once again, that the bad guys have won.
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John Byrne
Robot Wrangler
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 102266
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| Posted: 09 May 2005 at 6:19am | IP Logged | 9
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As someone who writes for a living, you'd think he'd try to get his point across better.**** In fact, this thread, and the response to it elsewhere, prove I got my point across perfectly -- use of a word does not make it "right".
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Connie Lynn
Byrne Robotics Member
Requested Cancelation
Joined: 22 March 2005
Posts: 44
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| Posted: 09 May 2005 at 6:28am | IP Logged | 10
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Perhaps you're missing the point so many people are making.
They're taking you to task for dropping the N-bomb in the middle of a
discussion that is so desperately trivial. You used so poor an
analogy, that the sheer negative aspects of that word are completely
over-powering your argument and people aren't even noticing the point
that you're making.
And you're being obtuse enough not to notice what they're doing.
You're still trying to make it all about "balloons" and "bubbles".
It's blonde hair & hookers and file sharing & rape all over again.
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John Byrne
Robot Wrangler
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Posts: 102266
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| Posted: 09 May 2005 at 6:38am | IP Logged | 11
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It's blonde hair & hookers and file sharing & rape all over again.******* You are exactly right, but not for the reasons you think you are. I suggest you seek out those instances in their original context, and then return with an informed comment, if you still feel you have one to make.
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Leroy Douresseaux
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 29 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 1657
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| Posted: 09 May 2005 at 7:43am | IP Logged | 12
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I refuse to allow that word to have power over me. I try not to get mad when people use it because in The Autobiography of Malcolm X, Malcolm (via Haley, of course) said that he wasn't mad at word balloons any more because word balloons couldn't help but be what they were... word balloons.
This is where Brandon is right, as I read his column - this was a slow train coming, but she was a'comin.' However, I'm not down for boycotts and letters to DC over this. You knew what you were doing and the crap storm it would create because you've been in America long enough to know that two of national pastimes are over reacting and hysteria. This was not the first time "nigger" came to life in one of your message board postings. I look forward to the next time. Best wishes!
BTW, someone please tell me that you have a HARDCOVER copy of Two Morrows' recent Wally Wood companion that you want to sell me.
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Topic Closed)
