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Eric Ladd Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 August 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 4505
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 7:12am | IP Logged | 1
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Nice post, Peter. I am always baffled when people ask for equal treatment for activities that are in no way equal. Hilary didn't have "an FBI plant/informant/spy" placed in her campaign because there was no indication anyone from her campaign was in contact with the Russian?! THAT is just unfair!!!
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Dave Kopperman Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 27 December 2004 Location: United States Posts: 3421
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 9:03am | IP Logged | 2
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Paul Buchanan wrote:
I don't post a lot because I don't have time to. |
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Uh?
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Michael Sommerville Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 April 2010 Location: Canada Posts: 417
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 12:17pm | IP Logged | 3
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One thing I do find interesting Is how Trump has been able to make grown, mature, intelligent people name call like children. He is called childish for the nicknames, and rightly so, but so many seem to justify calling him names. How many would/did decry people calling Obama immature names, like, Obuma, Dumbama, Hussein Obama and roll their eyes and think grow up? Don't those same people lose the intellectual high ground when they refer to Trump as, Grump, Rump, Chump, etc. The same action directed at two different people is either acceptable or not for both.
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Rebecca Jansen Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 February 2018 Location: Canada Posts: 4635
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 12:29pm | IP Logged | 4
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Yeah Rex Tillerson, it's not adult to call your boss a moron. :^|
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Michael Sommerville Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 April 2010 Location: Canada Posts: 417
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 12:47pm | IP Logged | 5
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I see that as a different thing. I think that if a person says "Obuma said x, y ,z" then I think at person is closed minded, but it is fine to say Trump is a moron because you can have a discussion to back it up.
I guess, in my mind, by bastardizing a person's name it is a way to dehumanize them so you can say anything. I think it always weakens an argument.
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Rebecca Jansen Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 February 2018 Location: Canada Posts: 4635
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 1:07pm | IP Logged | 6
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It's a good point. Some people will also go on about hair and especially make fun of the weight of various public figures. It's almost like a Monty Python old ladies skit "Ooh, no... I don't like his hair."
Edited by Rebecca Jansen on 03 June 2018 at 1:09pm
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Dave Kopperman Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 27 December 2004 Location: United States Posts: 3421
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 1:14pm | IP Logged | 7
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Michael Sommerville wrote:
I guess, in my mind, by bastardizing a person's name it is a way to dehumanize them so you can say anything. |
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Agreed completely. It's also weirdly insidious, to a point where people aren't even aware that they're doing it. During the 2016 primaries, it alarmed me to see how many of the more self-described progressive friends in my feed would consistently refer to Bernie Sanders as "Bernie" and Hillary Clinton as "HRC." The former sounds like a pal, the latter sounds like a corporate entity. Since they were Bernie supporters and I was a Hillary supporter, I was definitely much more aware of the subtle depersonalization of Hillary as part of the emotional undercurrent in their belief system.
The Trump/Rump thing is both the same and different - it's clearly deliberate, and is very intentionally meant as disrespectful, but it does have the same net effect - if you're inclined to find a pretext to dismiss someone's comments out of hand, their dismissal of "your guy" in such manner will give you the ammunition to do so.
I, of course, loathe Trump, and I do feel that his constant name-calling and dismissiveness of pretty much everybody who isn't a rich, white, straight, non-disabled Christian man has earned him any number of mocking sobriquets that I can easily get on board with, but I definitely admit that I cede the ability to enter a debate unbiased (to the other participants) if I lead with that.
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Thomas Woods Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 09 June 2004 Location: United States Posts: 1356
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 1:41pm | IP Logged | 8
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Acting Presidential: Bill Clinton
I saw a clip of Bill Clinton being interviewed and he is really good at playing the old man innocent traditional type, in interviews and on late night show appearances.
When asked what he thought about Trumps tweets, he said something like "My mom would have spanked me repeatedly for talking like that."
I somewhat agree with him that the internet is full of vile brats spewing all kinds of things that deserve a spanking from their parents, but I wanted to say, "The parents are doing it too!"
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Charles Valderrama Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 4849
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 1:56pm | IP Logged | 9
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One thing I do find interesting Is how Trump has been able to make grown, mature, intelligent people name call like children. He is called childish for the nicknames, and rightly so, but so many seem to justify calling him names.
****** I'd say that he's getting a small dose of his own medicine. You can certainly find it immature, but sometimes the way to shut down an obnoxious bully is to stand up to them in terms they understand.
'Course, with Trump, more effort must be made to show him that he's no Emperor... that he must, as a world leader, act Presidential.
-C!
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Charles Valderrama Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 4849
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 2:07pm | IP Logged | 10
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Without condoning Nugent, I think had someone called Obama's daughters what she called Trump's daughter, that person would have lucky just to lose their job. And beyond that it was never done.
***** I'm in awe that anyone could draw such a simple comparison.
Learning much about Trump's 'Merica.
-C!
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Thomas Woods Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 09 June 2004 Location: United States Posts: 1356
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 6:07pm | IP Logged | 11
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I've been speculating on this Trump colluding with the Russian government thing and what is going on if they actually DO have something on it.
They would have to be weighing the worth of it.
- How can Putin save face, he has already denied everything, will it hurt our relations and any dealings with them in the future?
- If Putin has dirt on them, he could come out and reveal things they don't want revealed in retaliation. If Russia has been hacking us, which I'm sure they do, they must be setting on a treasure of information that could hurt many in the political system.
- If the wikileaks exposure of the DNC rigging things against Sanders, is all Trump and Russia did together, is that worth bringing Hillary and the DNC into the spotlight again. Is that worth upturning the whole thing and pissing off half or more of the country ... what fallout will take place? Will there be riots.
If they do actually have something I think they are worried about some or all of that.
Edited by Thomas Woods on 03 June 2018 at 6:16pm
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Michael Sommerville Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 April 2010 Location: Canada Posts: 417
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Posted: 03 June 2018 at 7:23pm | IP Logged | 12
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It is foolish to speculate about the Russia inquiry and the Trump campaign because most of the publicly known information can be used to support both conclusions.
Take one thing and one person that people know, the meeting in Trump tower with the Russian lawyer. Kushner was part of a group that met with someone that has ties to the Kremlin for information on Clinton. Looks like a slam dunk for working with Russians for one side. The other side could argue that Kushner was cleared for Top Secret clearance by the FBI so the worst he did was have bad judgment.
Most people have their conclusion and use only the information that supports them and disregard any argument to the contrary as partisan. Both sides are guilty of this. When some people read a book they think they know how it will end. A Trump in Russia's pocket or a Witch hunt story is more interesting but there are only a few people that have enough facts to write the critical chapter to this story and then the people can write the ending.
Edited by Michael Sommerville on 03 June 2018 at 7:25pm
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