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Mark Waldman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 August 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 1273
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| Posted: 02 December 2017 at 2:16pm | IP Logged | 1
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Yesterday was quite a news day. I like how all the things we knew about during the election are finally being confirmed, only now we are strangle held by a criminal administration and terrible policies being rolled out. If only our checks and balances allowed for us to stop the train when we heard Russia intervention, Trump's love for Putin and all things Russia, his refusal to show his tax returns, etc. However this turns out - hopefully with people being thrown in jail - Putin still wins. He exposed the weaknesses in our democracy and took full advantage of them. The term "fake news" now in the lexicon when the only fake news is Fox' propaganda machine. Shameful stuff, scary times, but I'll take the small victories like yesterday.
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Fred J Chamberlain
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 30 August 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 4037
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| Posted: 02 December 2017 at 2:22pm | IP Logged | 2
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The first thing that a tyrant will do is undermine and/or destroy news
agencies and sources. As soon as he coined the phrase, I shivered at
what might follow.
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Michael Sommerville
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 April 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 417
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| Posted: 02 December 2017 at 6:02pm | IP Logged | 3
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Once again I have no horse in the race. Just trying to understand the facts without the emotion. The take I get is, Michael Flynn lied about doing something perfectly legal to the FBI. Talking to Russians was not outside his purview or a crime. So basically he was just an idiot. If he has any unverifiable information about Trump he is going to make a shitty witness. He did not disclose all information on security forms, was fired for lying to Pence and now is convicted of lying to the FBI.
I think some people are singing, Ding Dong the Witch is Dead, a little early. So far we have two guys charged with dealings unrelated to Trump from years ago and two guys pleading guilty to lying.
What other than obstruction of justice if proven can they charge Trump with? |
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David Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Posts: 3099
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| Posted: 02 December 2017 at 6:31pm | IP Logged | 4
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This Flynn announcement has brought out every conservative mall lawyer in America to insist Meuller has now released every bit of evidence his investigation has turned up, and that the specific charge in any plea deal quite obviously represents the most serious violations of the law. I mean, it's almost 7:30 pm Saturday on the east coast, and Mueller hasn't indicted anyone today. I guess it's all done, right?
It's malign wishful thinking, driven by right-wing "legal scholars" whose day jobs are as radio insult comics who function as party apparatchiks when they aren't selling gold coins and reverse mortgages to senior citizens. Men who haven't practiced law in decades, if they ever did, but remember just enough to gild their deceptions.
The only sensible response is to withhold judgement until more information is available.
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Michael Sommerville
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 April 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 417
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| Posted: 03 December 2017 at 3:23am | IP Logged | 5
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I agree David but include every Liberal mall lawyer and Left-wing "legal scholars". Both sides are fantasizing that this is the start of their ultimate Trump endgame. Neither side knows what Meuller has or has not found. Everything is speculation and it is humorous to see each side in their perspective huddles pointing and laughing at the other side.
I will not lie, I enjoy Alan Dershowitz take on things. I do not believe he is a Mall Lawyer or a Right-Wing legal scholar. He seems to look at this issue analytically and devoid of like or dislike of the players. I also enjoy Left-wing legal scholar, Jeffery Toobin's take even though he does not hide his disgust of the player involved.
Edited by Michael Sommerville on 03 December 2017 at 3:29am
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Matt Reed
Byrne Robotics Security
Robotmod
Joined: 16 April 2004
Posts: 36018
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| Posted: 03 December 2017 at 3:47am | IP Logged | 6
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Michael Sommerville wrote:
| The take I get is, Michael Flynn lied about doing something perfectly legal to the FBI. Talking to Russians was not outside his purview or a crime. So basically he was just an idiot. |
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It's more than him just being an idiot. He spoke to a hostile state during a time of transition when he was not at liberty to make any deals at all. He did so before "his guy" was sworn into office and while another President was still in power. That's a huge deal in and of itself. You can't do that. It's illegal. And he lied about it. It was absolutely "outside his purview" and it's totally "a crime" based on when he made the contact, which was before January 20, 2017.
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Brian Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 31229
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| Posted: 03 December 2017 at 7:56am | IP Logged | 7
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Not only that but he has admitted he did so under direction from then President-elect Trump.
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James Woodcock
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 September 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 7818
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| Posted: 03 December 2017 at 9:18am | IP Logged | 8
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Fart says that what he did was not a crime.
So that's that then
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Charles Valderrama
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4847
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| Posted: 03 December 2017 at 10:45am | IP Logged | 9
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OBSTRUCTION OF JUSTICE.
PROOF: Trump admitted he KNEW Michael Flynn lied to the FBI... yet tried to influence or stop the FBI investigation on Flynn by firing Comey.
Only a matter of time before the law catches up to him. Sadly, his accomplices in the GOP Congress will not go down with him.
-C!
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133458
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| Posted: 03 December 2017 at 11:21am | IP Logged | 10
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It's as if Rump has the mind of a child without the innocence of a child. He seems, like a child, to believe each lie writes over the previous one, but for him it is in some Orwellian way.
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Michael Sommerville
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 April 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 417
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| Posted: 03 December 2017 at 12:44pm | IP Logged | 11
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Almost every Legal analyst I have watched say talking to the Russians is only a crime, for candidate or president-elect and his people, if charged under the Logan Act. Many agree it would be a stretch to charge under that, and harder to get a conviction.Everyone knows Trump's tweets are full of lies and nonsense to stroke his ego. Everyone calls him out about his lying tweets, unless it is what they want to hear. So now his tweets are fact and proof he obstructed justice. I have said before that he is the hyper-active child that is always saying "look at me, look what i can do". He is the worlds most powerful Internet troll and media and people in general feed him. Responding to every stupid thing he says or does just feeds his fire. Even if he is POTUS, not everything he says or does is news worthy, most is just BS that should be ignored, but that would not be good for ratings.
Edited by Michael Sommerville on 03 December 2017 at 12:45pm
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Robbie Parry
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 June 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 12186
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| Posted: 03 December 2017 at 12:57pm | IP Logged | 12
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News reports are claiming that 45's lawyer wrote the tweet.
Which, coincidentally, happened to have an exclamation mark at the end. Most use exclamation marks sparingly; 45 uses them almost all of the time.
How convenient...
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