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John M. Jackson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 May 2015
Location: United States
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| Posted: 08 June 2015 at 1:13am | IP Logged | 1
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Petter, I really have too much work to do to keep this up.
But is there any sort of sexual cravings that can't be blamed on being born that way? Could you list some for me?
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Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004
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| Posted: 08 June 2015 at 1:13am | IP Logged | 2
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I just believe that people are so afraid of offending someone or not being politically correct that they might encourage someone's obsessions when they shouldn't.
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So what do you think would be the appropriate course of action if, as some research suggests, transsexualism is an instance of a gendered brain not matching a gendered body?
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Mark Haslett
Byrne Robotics Member
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| Posted: 08 June 2015 at 1:24am | IP Logged | 3
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This issue comes down to an age old question-- do men and women think the same? Or is there an inherent difference?
If gender is all in the body, it can be changed by changing the body.
If gender is in the mind, then it may be possible to have a body of one gender and the mind of another.
If such is the case, it would be a terrible battle to wake up every day and "be" the gender of your body without the inherent sense of belonging that should come with the equipment.
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John M. Jackson
Byrne Robotics Member
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| Posted: 08 June 2015 at 1:27am | IP Logged | 4
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Michael, you are born who you are. When I close my eyes I am just me. Not male. Not female. Just me.
Why do women wear dresses and men wear pants?
They are just clothes afterall.
In a parallel universe where it was reversed would we still feel the same way?
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Petter Myhr Ness
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 02 July 2009
Location: Norway
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| Posted: 08 June 2015 at 1:29am | IP Logged | 5
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So you think being gay is all about "sexual cravings"? It goes a little deeper than that, John. And none of my gay friends or family members feel the need to blame it on anything. But you can be damned sure they didn't make a conscious choice when they, early in their pubescence, realised they were attracted to boys/girls of their own gender.
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John M. Jackson
Byrne Robotics Member
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| Posted: 08 June 2015 at 1:43am | IP Logged | 6
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Petter, I believe everybody is bisexual. I believe societal dogma has a heavy influence on what is acceptable. Thus my example of the Spartans earlier.
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Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member
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| Posted: 08 June 2015 at 1:46am | IP Logged | 7
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Human brains are sexually dimorphic. Male and female brains are structurally different. Does it make more sense that these differences are tied to gender identity, or that gender is purely a social construct generated by how you respond to your outsides?
There's the case of David Reimer, a "normal" boy whose penis was destroyed in a botched circumcision and was subsequently reassigned as a female as an infant. Despite being outwardly female and having everyone tell him that he was a girl, he felt like a boy from a very young age. He only found out the truth when he was a teenager.
If his male gender identity was set at infancy, don't you think it is well within reason that one's gender identity can be set in the womb and that for whatever reason, it doesn't match one's genitals?
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
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| Posted: 08 June 2015 at 1:59am | IP Logged | 8
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If gender is in the mind, then it may be possible to have a body of one gender and the mind of another. ••• Here's a question: if one is, for instance, a "woman trapped in the body of a man," how would one know? Not having at any time been a woman, what is the frame of reference?
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John M. Jackson
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| Posted: 08 June 2015 at 2:07am | IP Logged | 9
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Michael, that story is one of the ones told at www.sexchangeregret.com web site.
It was used as an example of a sex reassignment surgery not really changing the sex of the person.
Of course, it probably didn't help that his doctor was molesting him and his brother.
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Michael Roberts
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| Posted: 08 June 2015 at 2:12am | IP Logged | 10
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It was used as an example of a sex reassignment surgery not really changing the sex of the person.
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Which doesn't really answer the question being posed. If his gender was set at birth despite his genitals telling him otherwise, is it within the realm of reason that gender can be set in the womb? And if so, does it follow that the gender set in the womb can be different from one's genitals?
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Mark Haslett
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| Posted: 08 June 2015 at 2:18am | IP Logged | 11
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Here's a question: if one is, for instance, a "woman trapped in the body of a man," how would one know? Not having at any time been a woman, what is the frame of reference?
**
If the genders don't think differently and gender is not in the mind, there couldn't be any.
But if the genders do think differently and gender is in the mind, then the process would, at first, be simply recognizing one doesn't think like the other men. Then recognizing a profound identification with the way women think would bring on that "trapped" feeling: "I belong with them".
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John M. Jackson
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| Posted: 08 June 2015 at 2:18am | IP Logged | 12
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Michael, I said I believe that both sexes can be feminine and masculine. He obviously was more masculine.
He was going through depression and that's why his parents told him what happened.
I am assuming being molested probably had something to do with the depression.
If he was feminine and wasn't being molested maybe he would never have known.
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Topic Closed)
