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Thanos Kollias
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 June 2004
Location: Greece
Posts: 5009
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| Posted: 02 August 2010 at 3:53pm | IP Logged | 1
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"Acclaim" means an awful lot more than mere "like and respect", Ian. I am sure you know that.
I like and respect Bob Hall but there is no way I could consider him the most acclaimed comics artist ever.
So, no, I don't think I am wrong. I am generalizing and exaggerating of course, but that's just a means of expression.
After all, I did say "vast majority", which by definition leaves a small minority to cover people who aren't embarrassed and think Moore is the most acclaimed comics writer ever.
You, Ian, don't belong in either of those categories...
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Ben Smith
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Joined: 01 July 2010
Location: United States
Posts: 81
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| Posted: 02 August 2010 at 6:04pm | IP Logged | 2
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Seems like an over-exaggeration to declare anyone that likes Moore to be embarassed of comic books, or ignorant of comic books. I would think it just means they like Alan Moore comic books. Personally, I find Chuck Austin's comics far more offensive.
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Andrew W. Farago
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Joined: 19 July 2005
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| Posted: 02 August 2010 at 7:00pm | IP Logged | 3
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QUOTE:
| I would think it just means they like Alan Moore comic books. |
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Ben,
That sounds about right to me. I don't see why being an Alan Moore fan and a superhero comics fan (or a John Byrne fan, or a Jack Kirby fan, or a Grant Morrison fan) are mutually exclusive things.
Edited by Andrew W. Farago on 02 August 2010 at 7:01pm
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Eric Smearman
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Joined: 02 September 2006
Location: United States
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| Posted: 02 August 2010 at 7:08pm | IP Logged | 4
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They're not. I'm a fan of all those and more!
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Thanos Kollias
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 June 2004
Location: Greece
Posts: 5009
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| Posted: 03 August 2010 at 12:50am | IP Logged | 5
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I find it interesting that you guys are arguing with me, about something I haven't actually written.
My posts came in response to posts about how acclaimed -in fact the most acclaimed comics writer of all time- Alan Moore is.
I see no problem with anyone liking or even loving Moore's work. I like V for Vendetta, for example. No conflict there.
Saying he is the most acclaimed, though, falls in the category I described earlier.
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Tim Farnsworth
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Joined: 01 July 2010
Posts: 817
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| Posted: 03 August 2010 at 1:13am | IP Logged | 6
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Hey, Thanos, would you agree that he's one of the most acclaimed comics writers?
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Thanos Kollias
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Joined: 19 June 2004
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| Posted: 03 August 2010 at 2:47am | IP Logged | 7
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There is no easy answer to this. His work has generated enough buzz, provides solid numbers of books sold and reprinted and Hollywood seems to like him. I also have no problem acknowledging he has quality in his work, albeit from time to time it tends to become over sophisticated and tiresome.
But, he has also produced some, imo, utter crap in his time, completely neglecting history of characters, genres and possibly the medium itself. Some find that refreshing. I find it offensive.
As for "acclaimed comics writer", the best thing I have heard about Moore is that Watchmen was listed in the best 100 novels of all time. Since Watchmen IS NOT a novel, you can understand my skepticism...
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Tim Farnsworth
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| Posted: 03 August 2010 at 3:08am | IP Logged | 8
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I'd say that whether or not he's produced good or bad work is irrelevant insofar as determining whether he's acclaimed. Things that I'd say mark him as acclaimed: *noted media exposure outside the comics world, from Rolling Stone coverage to BBC features *probably tops more polls of "best comic writer" than anyone else *strong consensus of acclaim from critics *Watchmen has been heavily featured in university courses *the Time Magazine acclaim, format semantics aside *9 Eisner Awards for Best Writer (plus lots of Harveys and Eagle Awards) *a Hugo award for Watchmen *numerous movie adaptations of his work (even if they sucked)
You don't have to like it, but it's pretty much a fact that he's acclaimed. Unless you want to go after the definition of acclaim, Bill Clinton style.
Edited by Tim Farnsworth on 03 August 2010 at 3:30am
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MIke Keane
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| Posted: 03 August 2010 at 4:02am | IP Logged | 9
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Thanos: As for "acclaimed comics writer", the best thing I have heard aboutMoore is that Watchmen was listed in the best 100 novels of all time.Since Watchmen IS NOT a novel, you can understand my skepticism...
------------------------------------------------------------ -------------------------------
Thanos, this is a meaningless distinction.
Time thought well enough of it to list it as both one of the 100greatest Novels of all time and one of the Greatest Graphic Novelssaying:
It is the only graphic novel to also be included in the All-TIME 100 Novels list.
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MIke Keane
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| Posted: 03 August 2010 at 4:57am | IP Logged | 10
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JB
Which, of course, it wasn't. WATCHMEN was a comicbook series latercollected into trade paperbacks and other such forms. At no point inits history was it ever a "graphic novel".
================================================
JB you say it is not a Graphic Novel, because it was a comic series, yet you have refered to JBNM as a nove (of sorts) can you explain the diference to me please?
(there is no snark meant in the question, just honest interest)
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Agapito Qhelas
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| Posted: 03 August 2010 at 5:10am | IP Logged | 11
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Moore is not simply one of the finest writers in comic book history. He's one of the world's finest writers, period.
http://www.salon.com/books/int/2004/07/22/moore
Moore is often referred to as the single best writer in the history of the comic book medium
http://www.english.ufl.edu/imagetext/archives/v2_2/carney/
Alan Moore is universally acknowledged as the most important mainstream comics writer of the last three decades
http://www.slate.com/id/2092739
I could copy dozens more. It's harder to find mentions of Alan Moore that aren't prefaced by the status he has in the industry.
So, yeah, his acclaim is unarguable. YMMV on whether it's deserved or not, of course.
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Thanos Kollias
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| Posted: 03 August 2010 at 5:35am | IP Logged | 12
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Alan Moore is universally acknowledged as the most important mainstream comics writer of the last three decades
+++++
I suspect you understand that this meaningless sentence carries as much or even less value than what I have said about Moore.
"Universally" means everybody, which is, evidently, false.
The same applies to all the other things you posted and I imagine to everything else you haven't posted.
And of course semantics can't be put aside. How can a comic be considered one of the best novels ever?!? Can a play in Broadway receive an Academy Award? No, because it is an entirely different medium/form of art. Isn't that obvious?
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Topic Closed)
