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Stéphane Garrelie Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 05 August 2005 Location: France Posts: 4226
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Posted: 14 August 2009 at 12:01pm | IP Logged | 1
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Also maybe some under-used classic talents will find some work again.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 133555
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Posted: 14 August 2009 at 12:06pm | IP Logged | 2
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Still, you gotta admit...during his reign there was a LOT of great stuff getting published by Marvel. Obviously I know nothing (cut & paste!) about what goes behind the scenes like JB does, but from the outside he appeared to do a lot of good back then.•• That was more in spite of, rather than because of, Shooter. It's true he came along at a time when Marvel had become a stumbling giant, and he did a lot to put the company back on the right path. But having "fixed" things he could not stop "fixing" -- especially after SECRET WARS -- and when you start "fixing" things that aren't broken, what you're really doing is breaking them.
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Stéphane Garrelie Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 05 August 2005 Location: France Posts: 4226
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Posted: 14 August 2009 at 12:19pm | IP Logged | 3
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It's not false that the post original Secret Wars years didn't do much to make Shooter's star shine.
The Second Secret Wars was a really awfull comicbook. Didn't do much damage, excepted for the crossover tie-ins that were forced on the creative teams, but frankly it was a really boring comic. I enjoyed some of those tie-ins though.
I also enjoyed Starbrand and later his Valiant and Defiant work.
As marvel writer, his run on Daredevil with Gil Kane & and Carmine Infantino is one i enjoyed.
Edited by Stéphane Garrelie on 14 August 2009 at 12:20pm
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Brian Floyd Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 07 July 2006 Location: United States Posts: 8649
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Posted: 14 August 2009 at 2:55pm | IP Logged | 4
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To me, Civil War just barely beats out Secret Wars II for the worst company-wide crossover event that M has done. And that's if I ignore the ramifications and aftermath of Civil War.
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Paulo Pereira Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 24 April 2006 Posts: 15539
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Posted: 14 August 2009 at 3:00pm | IP Logged | 5
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Yeah, I'd trade CW for SW II in an instant.
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Chris Durnell Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 26 February 2005 Location: United States Posts: 1234
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Posted: 14 August 2009 at 6:58pm | IP Logged | 6
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I'm a huge fan of Shooter even though I know he has burned bridges with many of my favorite creators. His Marvel tenure was really the second golden age. I find it hard to believe it was all just dumb luck. His Valiant work was also great, and just like when he departed Marvel, the magic ended (except it simply went downhill a lot quicker). Even though I found Defiant Comics less inspired, I still enjoyed some titles before the company folded during the market implosion.
He doesn't always make the best decisions, and he seems to have a very specific vision of what something should look like and monkeys around until it is. But overall, I've enjoyed his work. As bad as Secret Wars II was, besides some annoying crossover issues, I can't think of a single long lasting bad thing from it. On the other hand, the ongoing train wreck at Marvel has inflicted severe damage on many characters.
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Ted Pugliese Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 05 December 2005 Location: United States Posts: 7985
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Posted: 14 August 2009 at 7:03pm | IP Logged | 7
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All these ideas are interesting, but we are talking about John Byrne. Anything he does or would do would be great, especially to us. I figure as long as he is working, then we are ALL happy.
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Brad Hague Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 December 2006 Location: United States Posts: 1717
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Posted: 14 August 2009 at 7:38pm | IP Logged | 8
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I really liked Marvel (whether because of or in spite of Jim Shooter) up until about 1983-4.
Everyone seemed to be his friend until apparently his total power corrupted totally and bad ideas like Secret Wars II and New Universe caught up to him and he was sacked.
Now it seems to be the hip thing to address all his problems while downplaying all the good things that happened.
I don't know, I wasn't there. But maybe the good things were not quite as good as they seemed when everything was going great.
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Steve Adelson Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 24 May 2009 Location: United States Posts: 1206
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Posted: 14 August 2009 at 7:53pm | IP Logged | 9
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"The Ninth Circle is ringed by classical and Biblical giants.
The giants are standing either on the ninth circle of Hell, or on a
ledge above it, and are visible from the waist up at the ninth circle
of the Malebolge. The giant Antaeus
lowers Dante and Virgil into the pit that forms the ninth circle of
Hell. (Canto XXXI) Traitors, distinguished from the "merely" fraudulent
in that their acts involve betraying one in a special relationship to
the betrayer, are frozen in a lake of ice known as Cocytus. Each group of traitors is encased in ice to a different depth, ranging from only the neck and through to complete immersion."
Still, I don't expect to see it any time soon.
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Stephen Churay Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 March 2009 Location: United States Posts: 8369
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Posted: 14 August 2009 at 11:14pm | IP Logged | 10
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Too bad about the bad blood with Shooter, although I get it. Still, it'd be cool to see JB draw a Magnus: Robot Fighter book.
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Eric Smearman Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 02 September 2006 Location: United States Posts: 5839
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Posted: 15 August 2009 at 12:16am | IP Logged | 11
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Enjoyed Shooter's Valiant work, particularly Solar and Magnus.
His recent Legion run was pretty good too.
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James Woodcock Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 September 2007 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 7854
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Posted: 15 August 2009 at 3:07am | IP Logged | 12
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Valient when Shooter was there was an amazing comic company. Yes there was some derivative charaters (At first glance) but they managed to put enough of a swing on them that they felt new - X-O Manowar being one of those. I also thought Unity was possibly the best company wide crossover I've ever read, a real pain to try to read in order but still the best.
I also thought the dating convention added a new twist, as evidenced when Harbringers went into space and came back to find that things had radically changed. That first alien invasion was begun in a very subtle way.
BUT, I would say the lasting effect of Secret Wars II is the annual company wide crossovers that derail whatever is going on in the comics at the time the event happens (Although Crisis is probably more responsible for this as it came out first). Remember that we are now in a situation where individual titles by and large service the larger picture rather than the other way around (Which to be fair was exactly the remit at Valient. But it was set up that way and so I didn't mind. The difference is, Marvel was not set up that way. That was set up with guest appearances, not crossovers).
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