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Ben Schwartz
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 13 September 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 168
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| Posted: 08 January 2008 at 1:19pm | IP Logged | 1
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SER: Venom is a great concept but he was doomed in his first
appearance. A character who knows Spider-Man's true identity will
quickly become a one-trick pony (or worse an "anti-hero" who our hero
makes deals with). I don't think there was any plan for Venom outside
of his first appearance.
Your mention of long-term plans for Venom triggered a memory of an interview with David Michelinie in which he said that he originally intended Venom to die in either issue 350 or 375, but the character's immense popularity caused a change in plans. Does anyone else remember hearing or reading this? I checked the "Comics Creators on Spider-Man" book and it's not mentioned there, but I'm pretty sure I've actually read that.
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Victor Rodgers
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 26 December 2004
Posts: 3508
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| Posted: 08 January 2008 at 1:19pm | IP Logged | 2
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http://spideykicksbutt.com/DeepThoughts/OneMoreDay.html
He seems not to really get Spider-Man.
Edited by Victor .R. Rodgers on 08 January 2008 at 1:20pm
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Bruce Buchanan
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 14 June 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 4797
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| Posted: 08 January 2008 at 1:20pm | IP Logged | 3
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I've always enjoyed J.R. Fettinger's ("MadGoblin") Spider-Man essays, even if I don't always agree.
*************
I agree, Greg. He is probably the most insightful Spider-Man commentator out there. I just wish he'd publish a bit more often!
Edited by Bruce Buchanan on 08 January 2008 at 1:30pm
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Greg Kirkman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 May 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 15775
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| Posted: 08 January 2008 at 1:23pm | IP Logged | 4
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Here's another interesting series of essays:
http://thecomiccrypt.com/viewtopic.php?t=4440
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Ben Schwartz
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 13 September 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 168
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| Posted: 08 January 2008 at 1:36pm | IP Logged | 5
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By the way, since I'm having an uncharacteristic posting spree (this will be my third post in one sitting!), I might as well lay out a big "thank you" to our host, John Byrne, for helping me understand and better appreciate my favorite superhero, Spider-Man. I am 26 years old and grew up with a married, older Spider-Man. It never occurred to me that this was a problem. I first started using the internet around the time JB began his run on Chapter One(side note: I always thought "Twice Told Tales" sounded better) and ASM, and I remember interviews with JB and Howard Mackie discussing the challange they faced in "fixing" a character whose fans, for the most part, did not realize was "broken." At first I went through all the mental gymnastics that we're now seeing all over the internet in terms of justifying the status quo--"it's a natural growth," "the book has always been about change," etc, etc...but JB's well-reasoned arguments made me think about the issue, rather than just react on emotion, and upon further reflection, it becomes crystal clear that Spider-Man is an allegory for youth. He should only get married and live happily ever after in the final issue. (Tangential Rant: I am so tired of the legions of anonymous internet posters who argue that marriage doesn't affect the core of Spider-Man since the core is "with great power comes great responsibility." That phrase may be closely associated with Spidey, but it's just a general truth about EVERY superhero! If that's ALL you think Spider-Man is about, you don't know what you're talking about.)
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133580
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| Posted: 08 January 2008 at 1:40pm | IP Logged | 6
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Thanks, Ben!
Those who argue that marriage does not impact on the core of who and what Spider-Man is, because that core is "with great power must come great responsibility", seem to be missing just how much responsibility goes into being a husband and father. In a city that is almost wall to wall superheroes -- if Doctor Octopus goes on a rampage and Spider-Man isn't there, can we really imagine that no one will stop him? -- where do Peter Parker's greatest responsibilities lie?
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Paulo Pereira
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 24 April 2006
Posts: 15539
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| Posted: 08 January 2008 at 1:40pm | IP Logged | 7
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This line jumped out at me from the first essay...
"...Joe Quesada has slain a dragon that become his personal boogeyman to win the hearts and minds of an audience that may not even exist."
I'm not saying I agree with this or not, but this question did occur to me.
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Victor Rodgers
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 26 December 2004
Posts: 3508
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| Posted: 08 January 2008 at 1:42pm | IP Logged | 8
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I thought Quesada said kids never read comics?
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Zaki Hasan
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 8105
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| Posted: 08 January 2008 at 1:46pm | IP Logged | 9
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http://spideykicksbutt.com/DeepThoughts/OneMoreDay.html
******
Thanks for posting this, Greg. I pretty much agree with his thoughts on the story as well as his reactions to it.
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Glenn Greenberg
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6746
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| Posted: 08 January 2008 at 1:50pm | IP Logged | 10
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<<< better than JMS's idea of carefully constructing an alternate timeline
to explain every last, little, anal retentive fanboy continuity problem >>>
But if that alternate timeline actually WORKS, and DOES address most if
not all of those continuity problems, and gets you to the endpoint that
everybody has agreed upon, I say go for it.
Right now, it seems like the only major difference between JMS's original
idea and what saw print is that Gwen isn't back. And JQ has gone on
record as saying that he SUPPORTED the idea of bringing back Gwen until
fairly late in the game, when some of his editors and writers finally talked
him out of it.
Seems like JMS intended to end his story with a single Pete, back with the
mechanical web-shooters, and some of the deceased cast members alive
and well--which is how the printed version ended. So how much of a
problem would it have been to tie JMS's version in neatly with BND?
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Don Zomberg
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 23 November 2005
Posts: 2355
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| Posted: 08 January 2008 at 2:02pm | IP Logged | 11
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Ugh, how I hate the Spider-Man is about "responsibility" crowd. He's supposed to be about youth, and all the angst and drama that goes with it.
And what the hell is a comic revolving around "responsibility" supposed to be about, anyway? The main character paying his bills on time, listening to his wife, fixing the trash disposal?
Sounds like exciting stuff to me.
And on a side note--John Romita Jr is the Hobgoblin artist.
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Joe Hollon
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 May 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 13705
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| Posted: 08 January 2008 at 2:09pm | IP Logged | 12
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Don,
Is that last post serious?
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Topic Closed)
