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John Byrne
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Grumpy Old Guy

Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 134854
Posted: 22 January 2008 at 8:46am | IP Logged | 1  

This is not unlike those people who insist on "waiting for the DVD" when
it comes to television. Instead of watching a show week by week, the way
the creators intended it to be "watched," these people let episodes
accumulate for weeks or even months. Then, when they finally get around
to watching them, they are doing so not at all in the manner intended,
and thus do not get the "experience" intended. If the show's creators
intended people to watch the show that way they would have aired the
"episodes" that way. And now they'r ebeing "catered" to! Selfish television
fans are changing the way TV shows are made.

••

Really? I admit to not paying a whole lot of attention, so I have not
noticed this phenomenon. How do you see the way in which television
shows are made being altered in anticipation of the DVD release? I have
most certainly seen this with movies, where directors sometimes actually
"finish" the movie on the DVD, but not with TV.

I wonder if this analogy is perhaps a trifle forced? TV, being a weekly
format, presents a package that already has a different kind of
"anticipation" level than we'd find in a monthly periodical. Most TV
shows, for example, don't play to the same kind of anticipation. They
often have running subplots -- especially dramas -- but those are not
the main thrust, episode to episode. Thus, when the episodes are viewed
"clumped together" we still see the main story of each one, and the
subplots continue to unfold as subplots.

But you have definitely piqued my interest! Please, point me to some of
the shows that have adapted themselves or in other ways changed
because of the advent of DVDs. As a longtime "student" of the medium,
this is something I would find quite fascinating!
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Thorsten Brochhaus
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Posted: 22 January 2008 at 9:27am | IP Logged | 2  

Another excellent observation, JB. This is not unlike those people who insist on "waiting for the DVD" when it comes to television. Instead of watching a show week by week, the way the creators intended it to be "watched," these people let episodes accumulate for weeks or even months. Then, when they finally get around to watching them, they are doing so not at all in the manner intended, and thus do not get  the "experience" intended. If the show's creators intended people to watch the show that way they would have aired the "episodes" that way. And now they'r ebeing "catered" to! Selfish television fans are changing the way TV shows are made.

--------


In germany it is almost impossible to follow a TV series on TV. You have to to buy or at least watch it on DVD to have any "expierience" at all.
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Martin Redmond
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Posted: 22 January 2008 at 9:31am | IP Logged | 3  

I think the only reason I enjoyed Lost was that I got to see so many episodes together at a time. And I skipped a whole lot of flashbacks. I doubt I would've waited week after week for it.
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Allen Moyer
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Posted: 22 January 2008 at 9:36am | IP Logged | 4  

But you have definitely piqued my interest! Please, point me to some of
the shows that have adapted themselves or in other ways changed
because of the advent of DVDs. As a longtime "student" of the medium,
this is something I would find quite fascinating!

---


A good example, considering this forum, would be Heroes, a show very much written with DVD in mind. Seasons are intended to be standalone story arcs that also tie into a larger narrative, not unlike trade paperbacks. Episodes, however, generally are not. Starting with the second season, arcs within the season are titled. Now the first so many episodes can be packaged together in one set, the second arc within the season packaged as another set, and so on. Other TV shows have already done this. The Sopranos final season, for example, came out in two separate season sets. Makes for better marketing and sales opportunities.

Shows like 24 and Lost are very reflective of the new attitudes in television writing. Long, extended storylines that build towards a definite end, very deliberate pacing, and a reliance on fiercely loyal viewers who comb the episodes for clues. Step into an episode of 24 and you might as well be watching the middle of a movie. It's like grabbing a random issue of Amazing Spider-Man. You can't do it anymore! You're getting part 3 of 6, not a self-contained story. Note how quickly season sets for these shows are released. It's not about archiving the show for posterity, like most DVD sets, it's a part of the overall marketing plan. This is very similar to what is happening with trade paperbacks.

The TV people are clearly aware of DVD's impact on viewership. Family Guy was canceled and brought back thanks to DVD. A show you enjoy, Battlestar Galactica, has seen some episodes extended for the DVD, adding in scenes that weren't in the broadcast. Great show, very well-written. The pacing of the show tends to run slower than one might expect, though, in part because the creators know the show does well on DVD. BG watches GREAT when you see several episodes in a short period of time. People watch this stuff in spurts, clumps of episodes all together at once. They string together well, but don't necessarily standalone as well as hour-long dramas used to.

That's the big red flag. No need to tell you that hour-long dramas have long had extended subplots that ran from episode to episode, but each episode also stood pretty strongly on its own. Beginning, middle, and end, with some stuff in there to carry through the season. Not unlike the comics of yesteryear, if you think about it. Sounds like some JB comics! These days, however, it's increasingly common to see shows that all but require viewing multiple episodes. No one watches one episode of 24. Just one episode doesn't cut it! You only get a sliver of story. It's never something self-contained. They can get away with that now in part because DVD lets them. They no longer need worry that viewers will miss a few episodes, because DVD is there.

The more you look at it, the more some of this sounds like the comic industry. I wonder, is it the TV people influencing comics or the comics people influencing TV?

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Allen Moyer
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Posted: 22 January 2008 at 9:39am | IP Logged | 5  

It's only fair of me to mention that many people really LIKE the strung out, extended way that 24 and Lost and Heroes tell their stories. They like the week-to-week anticipation. The writers do as good a job playing into that as they do ensuring their entire season comes together like one really, really long movie.
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Stephen Robinson
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Posted: 22 January 2008 at 9:49am | IP Logged | 6  

Sometimes just the anticipation was enough, back in the days before
continued stories and cliffhangers.

*********

SER: Yes, that's how TV was for me as a kid. CHEERS, for instance, for hardly serialized but there was nothing like knowing that, come Thursday, there'd be a new episode.

TiVo and DVDs have changed the way many people watch TV now -- preferring to catch a whole season when it's convenient to them, effectively removing the "anticipation." My girlfriend chose to watch HEROES this way.

It's hard to resist instant gratification, though, when watching shows this way. I watched the first 3 seasons of Nip/Tuck in one month but after almost binging on them, I found myself trying to set up a system for viewing them (1 episode a night and so on). I do this with the ESSENTIALS and SHOWCASE editions (1 "issue" per night, with an exception for rainy day weekends). I find that being able to watch/read something whenever I want to can remove the fun of "looking foward" to something.

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Brad Danson
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Posted: 22 January 2008 at 9:59am | IP Logged | 7  

It bothers me when people watch a Lost season all in one sitting.  All the conversations I have in anticipation of the next episode is A LOT of the fun.



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John Byrne
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Joined: 11 May 2005
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Posted: 22 January 2008 at 10:04am | IP Logged | 8  

A good example, considering this forum, would be Heroes, a show very
much written with DVD in mind. Seasons are intended to be standalone
story arcs that also tie into a larger narrative, not unlike trade
paperbacks. Episodes, however, generally are not. Starting with the
second season, arcs within the season are titled. Now the first so many
episodes can be packaged together in one set, the second arc within the
season packaged as another set, and so on. Other TV shows have already
done this. The Sopranos final season, for example, came out in two
separate season sets. Makes for better marketing and sales opportunities.

••

This seems to be something other than what you were writing about in
your initial post on this subject. The producers packaging the shows in
anticipation of a DVD release seems very different from
changing the shows for the benefit of those who will only be
watching them on DVD. In the second instance we would be talking
about content, but in the first about marketing.
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John Byrne
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Grumpy Old Guy

Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 134854
Posted: 22 January 2008 at 10:06am | IP Logged | 9  

It bothers me when people watch a Lost season all in one sitting. All the
conversations I have in anticipation of the next episode is A LOT of the fun.


••

I expect that "watercooler shows" would get a more conventional viewing
from me -- vis 30 ROCK -- if I had a watercooler and an office crowd
to interact with!
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Robin Taylor
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Posted: 22 January 2008 at 10:14am | IP Logged | 10  

I would say the only analogy that fits is in the case of Lost or 24 where it is virtually impossible to step into the middle of season and start watching with any hope of knowing what the hell is going on, much like many current comics.

One season of 24 (3rd?) I didn't starting watching until 4 episodes into the story and stopped immediately after watching that ep, as I couldn't follow it. Since then if I have been unable to start watching a new season of 24 from ep 1 continuously I wait for the dvd. Lost, I watched one episode of and was appropriately lost, haven't watched it since. I have never had that experience before where a tv show was so impenetrable that it turned me off after one episode.

RT
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Joe Hollon
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Posted: 22 January 2008 at 10:15am | IP Logged | 11  

JB: "I expect that "watercooler shows" would get a more conventional viewing
from me....if I had a watercooler"

*****

I think you should try fitting a watercooler next to the polar bear in the wheelchair.  :0)
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Joe Hollon
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Posted: 22 January 2008 at 10:19am | IP Logged | 12  

I've yet to watch an episode of LOST and don't know much of anything about it.  It seems to me they are marketing it as "The Show You Can't Afford to Miss".  I guess this helps keep an audience but it might be hard to attract new viewers.  Kinda sounds like the current state of the comic industry now that I think about it.  
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