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Derek Muthart
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Posted: 15 July 2007 at 7:40am | IP Logged | 1  

Ever since Marvel and DC started putting an emphasis on developing their intellectual properties for television and film they have been deconstructing the whole costume thing.  I think it has a lot to do with how difficult it is to make brightly colored costumes look good on the big screen.  It's just easier to go with black.

In addition, any potential new readers who discovered the X-men through the movies would probably be turned off by seeing the X-men galvanting around in colorful spandex, rather than the sleek, black costumes they wore in the movie.

Of course we could say screw the new reader, but if any industry needs an infusion of youth, it's this one. 

Personally, I like the colorful costumes more, but I also realize Marvel and DC are for profit companies with shareholders who demand a return on their investment.  If black costumes test better and make the company more money then the costumes are going to be black.

 

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Paulo Pereira
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Posted: 15 July 2007 at 7:44am | IP Logged | 2  


 QUOTE:
If Cyclops is a character who should never kill under any circumstances, then Superman certainly is. So why did you have Superman kill the Pocket-Universe Phantom Zone villains?

JB: "...Cyclops might kill another human. Batman might kill. Superman might kill. But always -- always -- as an absolute last resort."

Not an absolute first resort, as with Cyclops "mercifully" ending Ugly John's life.  The scary thing is there was apparently no hesitation involved, no soul-searching, no nothin' (such as, as previously mentioned, no thought that there might be some way to save his life with, like, I dunno, medical technology and stuff). 

It was as if it was SOP.  Fairly disturbing, if you think about it.  Also, the statement Cyclops makes before he euthanizes UJ, "I know there's something more than just this world" is pretty offensive as well.

I'm trying to give Morrison the benefit of the doubt here; maybe I'm missing some context here.  I haven't read the issue, perhaps there were repercussions later?

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John Byrne
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Posted: 15 July 2007 at 7:59am | IP Logged | 3  

Ever since Marvel and DC started putting an emphasis on developing their intellectual properties for television and film they have been deconstructing the whole costume thing.  I think it has a lot to do with how difficult it is to make brightly colored costumes look good on the big screen.  It's just easier to go with black.

In addition, any potential new readers who discovered the X-men through the movies would probably be turned off by seeing the X-men galvanting around in colorful spandex, rather than the sleek, black costumes they wore in the movie.

•••

In the days before CGI made just about anything possible, I used to say that comics had one great advantage over movies, and I defined this by pointing out that if George Lucas wanted to film on an alien planet he had to fly his cast and crew to Tunisia, whereas I just shot on location.

This is no longer the case, of course, as animators can now create anything they want for the actors to walk around in --- including some of the actors doing the walking! But comics can still have a bit of an edge, here and there, and one such place is in the costumes. The only impediment to costumes in comics is the design skill -- or lack thereof -- of the artists involved.

Whenever some bozo from Hollywood says the costumes would be "hard to realize" or "just look goofy" on screen, they are admitting failure. To see superhero comics reinvent themselves in imitation of this failure indicates the sad depths to which the industry has sunk. Stan Lee and Jack Kirby didn't scale down to "be like Hollywood". They set out to beat Hollywood at its own game.

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Paulo Pereira
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Posted: 15 July 2007 at 8:25am | IP Logged | 4  

I prefer animated superheroes (done right, of course).

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Erin Anna Leach
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Posted: 15 July 2007 at 8:39am | IP Logged | 5  

I feel that this " Lets get rid of those silly costumes" way of thinking is running rampant over at the big M. I think it has to do with trying to fit in with Hollywoods failure, and I think they think the general public thinks the costumes are silly as well. I hate to say it, but I think they may try this stunt with Spider man as well. They've revealed his identity to the world, so why would he need to wear a mask and costume now. Of course this whole mess is totally away from the character, but the character doesn't seem to be as important any more. I don't understand why they think this way, when they proved that the original concept of the character works well today. I hate to sound in favor of this book, but it proves my point. Ultimate Spider man, when it started out, stayed close to the original concept of the character, and it did well in monthly sales. It also brought in some new readers that were kids, my son for one. Stan Lee's concepts for the characters still works today, as does the formula of a good story, plus good artwork, equals monthly sales.

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Derek Muthart
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Posted: 15 July 2007 at 10:45am | IP Logged | 6  

Stan Lee's concepts for the characters still works today, as does the formula of a good story, plus good artwork, equals monthly sales.

****************

I agree with you Adam.  The Spider-man movie that did the best at the box office, the first one ($403 million), is the one they changed the least.

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Chad Carter
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Posted: 15 July 2007 at 11:46am | IP Logged | 7  

 

The breakdown doesn't begin and end in comic books, as far as the inability of the creators to accept costumes, coincidence, and the conventions of high adventure stories. The breakdown is all through popular culture, as "reality" television continues to dominate, as the basics of good story-telling are buried under mounds of melodrama and fake emotional incidence. As the culture moves away from literate stories to emotion-based stories, you're seeing the swift removal or even the odd dismissal of conventional methods of portraying genre fiction. In Hollywood and at the Big Two anyway, the idea of adventure, of action that is clear and concise, and actual story itself is suffering immensely.

In other parts of the world film community, this isn't a problem. Outside of Hollywood, the filmmakers are not afraid of adventure conventions, and embrace the hyperreal aspects of costumes and super powers easily, like Hong Kong and Japan and Thailand and Korea in particular.

There's a few cats in Hollywood who understand the beauty of adventure/action and how it relates to comic book material, like Zack Snyder, who lovingly slowed down the action for maximum effect in 300. Tarantino's KILL BILL is almost literally a comic book, as is GRINDHOUSE. And in the best ways, these films rarely apologize for their dynamic adoration of "embarrassing" action. I'll also add Martin Campbell's work on CASINO ROYALE. Also, Robert Rodriguez

I'd love to see Frank Miller's THE SPIRIT finally and completely embrace the pulpy adventure aspects, blow the action into full-on comic book dynamics on a scale we haven't seen since RAIDERS OF THE LOST ARK maybe, and just forget the "reality" of filmmaking, which is an oxymoron.

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Roque Martinez
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Posted: 15 July 2007 at 1:08pm | IP Logged | 8  


 QUOTE:
an ever shrinking and aging fan base that should have moved on years ago


Curiously, those who seemed to despise NXM the most are part of that 'ever shrinking and aging fan base that should have moved on years ago'

I read a lot of "I've never read comics in my life, but NXM is fantastic" in its time.
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Zaki Hasan
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Posted: 15 July 2007 at 1:46pm | IP Logged | 9  

Yeah, me too. 
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Chad Carter
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Posted: 15 July 2007 at 1:58pm | IP Logged | 10  

I read a lot of "I've never read comics in my life, but NXM is fantastic" in its time.

Not to harp, but is this meaning that comics are so specialized to the tastes of a "young" readership that the "aging" fanbase is devoid of understanding the basics of good story-telling and long-time series character motivations and behaviors?

The fact of never reading comics before, but then indicating NEW X-MEN is "fantastic" seems odd. It's like being a virgin and then having inter-species sex with a ewe and saying, "Wow, I've never had sex before, but that was great!"

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Thanos Kollias
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Posted: 15 July 2007 at 2:00pm | IP Logged | 11  

So, yes, he did kiss Emma over Jean's grave. With Jean's full permission and approval.
++++++++++++++++
The sad part is that Cyclops kissed Emma over Jean's grave a few days after her death. Whether Jean gave him permission or not is irrelevent. Scott is written badly.

The page I posted earlier, along with all the scenes Cyclops appeared in JB's run are the reasons I love this character so much. Also, why I will never like Morrison's run.
Was it an interesting run? Yes.  Was it well written? Yes.
Did it include good X-Men stories? No, the guys in it only had the names to associate them with the characters.
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Christopher Alan Miller
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Posted: 15 July 2007 at 2:16pm | IP Logged | 12  

The fact of never reading comics before, but then indicating NEW X-MEN is "fantastic" seems odd. It's like being a virgin and then having inter-species sex with a ewe and saying, "Wow, I've never had sex before, but that was great

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

It's like people who have never read Dune saying Lynch's movie version is good.

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