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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133571
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| Posted: 20 January 2007 at 9:15am | IP Logged | 1
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How do you know the current professionals are addicted to making comics for the money?+++ Some have said it in so many words. That's a pretty good clue. +++ Many have also said that they love what they do. In the case of the many writers that come from other mediums, they indeed do it for love. *** I think I am beginning to see an underlying problem with this threadI when I say "there are professionals who do thus-and-such" some of you are altering this in your minds to "ALL professionals do thus-and-such." Nowhere have I said this. OF COURSE there are people who are in it for love of the characters and the stories. Unfortunately, this in no way alters the fact that there are those -- some of whom weild a fair bit of power -- who have said in so many words that they hate the superhero genre, or that they are only in it for the money, or both. (Oddly, these are both charges that the Byrne Bashers have leveled against me, despite all evidence to the contrary, and while simultaneously lionizing those who make no bones about this being their position.)
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Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
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| Posted: 20 January 2007 at 9:20am | IP Logged | 2
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I remember Marvel honcho Axel Alonso saying he doesn't like superheroes in an interview. Or I might be remembering reading another editor saying that about Alonso.
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Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
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| Posted: 20 January 2007 at 9:24am | IP Logged | 3
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David Schimmel, why don't you call out Sadowski for this :
"
Ummm..okaaaayy..
People asking you to draw them what they want? Money?"
I'd rather be a zealot than two-faced.
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Fred J Chamberlain
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 30 August 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 4044
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| Posted: 20 January 2007 at 9:25am | IP Logged | 4
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>
The big difference between the two camps really gets down to who is embarassed about this stuff..
The biggest issue that I see here is when this debate, or any other for that matter, is broken to and viewed as having only two camps. that oversimplifies the issues and no real forward movement or understanding can come of it.
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Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
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| Posted: 20 January 2007 at 9:29am | IP Logged | 5
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"that oversimplifies the issues and no real forward movement or understanding can come of it."
Oh goodness, will peace ever come to the Middle East?
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Wallace Sellars
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 May 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 17700
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| Posted: 20 January 2007 at 9:34am | IP Logged | 6
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Wow. It's funny how those who happen to agree with a point of view that John Byrne holds are labeled as zealots by some, but people who join the forum for what appears to be the express purpose of taking him on are given a pat on the back by the same.
Speaking of the Captain America/Falcon stories... I really enjoyed rereading the issues presented in the most recent ESSENTIAL CAPTAIN AMERICA volume. The John Romita. Sr. work was especially impressive. I do think they should have titles this volume CAPTAIN AMERICA & THE FALCON though. Oh, and I was hoping they'd get to the issue where Sam gets his wings, but I'll have to wait for the next one for that.
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Darragh Greene
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 March 2005
Location: Ireland
Posts: 1812
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| Posted: 20 January 2007 at 9:40am | IP Logged | 7
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Michael Penn wrote:
Darragh, my composite was based on more than
one posting and the aggregate of all the assumptions within them. |
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Michael, I don't think your interpretation of Stephen's posts is fair. I think
that your post invidiously caricatured his position and smuggled in some
assumptions of your own about his motives. I know you are familiar with
the principle of charity in discussion and debate, and I think it would
become you if you applied it when addressing Stephen's posts.
Michael wrote:
In the end I still don't see why Stephen Sadowski has, as
he said, a warrant to make any assumptions about John Byrne simply
because he didn't receive the "type" of answer he wanted from JB. |
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That's a fair point. Stephen?
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Fred J Chamberlain
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 30 August 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 4044
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| Posted: 20 January 2007 at 9:42am | IP Logged | 8
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>>"that oversimplifies the issues and no real forward movement or understanding can come of it."
>Oh goodness, will peace ever come to the Middle East?
Of course those who continually choose to miss the point add nothing. I made the point with the idea in mind that people come here to exchange thoughts, opinions, etc. If they are not open to hearing contradictory thoughts or even challenging themselves, than it ends up being no more than an exercise in mental masturbation. Sure, you get a warm tingly feeling and perhaps a giggle out of hitting the "send" button, but it doesn't really produce anything.
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Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
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| Posted: 20 January 2007 at 9:43am | IP Logged | 9
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I'm just saying it's not that complicated a problem. Sorry about my snarkiness, though.
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Darragh Greene
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 March 2005
Location: Ireland
Posts: 1812
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| Posted: 20 January 2007 at 9:46am | IP Logged | 10
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Wallace Sellars wrote:
Wow. It's funny how those who happen to agree
with a point of view that John Byrne holds are labeled as zealots by some,
but people who join the forum for what appears to be the express
purpose of taking him on are given a pat on the back by the same. |
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Who are these 'some' and 'same', Wallace?
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Aki Himmanen
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: Finland
Posts: 635
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| Posted: 20 January 2007 at 9:46am | IP Logged | 11
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This thread reminds me of a conversation I once had with my girlfriend. And had again soon afterwards. I paraphrase:
Me: "Let's have fish fingers!"
Her: "No."
Me: "But fish fingers are brilliant."
Her: "I don't care. I don't like fish."
Me: "I'll fry you up some fish fingers! I'm sure you'll love them!"
Her: "I don't like fish!"
Me: "You obstinate fool, why will you not understand the brilliance of fish fingers?"
Her: "I... DON'T... LIKE... FISH."
Me: "But..."
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Michael Penn
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 April 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 12767
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| Posted: 20 January 2007 at 9:57am | IP Logged | 12
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I was definitely being snide and sardonic, Darragh. Guilty. But it's no assumption to infer Stephen Sadowski's scolding disapproval of JB from his postings. Even the thread title is provocative -- "...ANYTHING you enjoy these days?" And as others have noted, he later attributes money as the driving force behind JB's recent work. Just unfair.
But, you know, as Stephen said, he's a big boy, and I'm infinitely less than a nobody in his world, and not much more on this forum, so I'm sure he'll be fine with my or any other posting.
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Topic Closed)
