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Rance Johnson Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 28 May 2005 Location: United States Posts: 269
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Posted: 25 June 2006 at 6:17pm | IP Logged | 1
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Jason Fulton wrote:
If you think that Alan Moore producing kid's porn graphic novels is OK. |
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Actually, I think it's kinda weird. But, I see no harm in allowing people to embrace their inner weirdness as long as no one is hurt in the process.
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Jacob P Secrest Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 18 October 2004 Location: United States Posts: 4068
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Posted: 25 June 2006 at 6:29pm | IP Logged | 2
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Joe Zhang wrote:
Has anyone given any thought to how a pedophile could use Lost Girls to
seduce their victims? |
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That is genuinely absurd, so you want to ban candy?
How about teddy bears?
Virtual child porn is perfectly legal, so him depicting kids in sexual acts in
a comic, even graphically is perfectly legal.
It may be tasteless, especially considering they aren't his characters, but
it isn't illegal.
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Wallace Sellars Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 01 May 2004 Location: United States Posts: 17739
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Posted: 25 June 2006 at 6:45pm | IP Logged | 3
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Wow.
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Jason Fulton Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 16 April 2004 Posts: 3938
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Posted: 25 June 2006 at 6:48pm | IP Logged | 4
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Well, at least we know Secrest didnt put JZ on ignore.
Edit: Spelling.
Edited by Jason Fulton on 25 June 2006 at 6:49pm
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Jacob P Secrest Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 18 October 2004 Location: United States Posts: 4068
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Posted: 25 June 2006 at 6:51pm | IP Logged | 5
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Yeah, I decided against it, I don't like the idea of the Ignore list, it just
seems counter productive to me, no matter how much someone may get
on my nerves.
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Al Cook Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 21 December 2004 Posts: 12735
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Posted: 25 June 2006 at 6:58pm | IP Logged | 6
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Rey Madrinan wrote:
The man stuck characters he didn't own into a porno book! I can't believe
someone can even begin to defend him.
Then Rance Johnson replied:
Actually, "the man" depicted two characters he didn't own engaged in anal
sex that was published by a company that did own the characters, who
also paid him for his efforts. There was no betrayal by the writer to the
owner's of the characters.
+++
Rance, I believe the reference was to Moore and Lost Girls, not to the
Bendis Luke Cage episode.
And on that front, Moore stuck characters he didn't own into a porno
book! I, too, can't believe someone can even begin to defend him!!!
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Joe Zhang Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 12857
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Posted: 25 June 2006 at 6:58pm | IP Logged | 7
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"How about teddy bears?
"
Lost Girls would be the equivalent of a teddy bear with private parts sown on.
"It may be tasteless, especially considering they aren't his characters, but
it isn't illegal."
But is it right?
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Joe Zhang Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 12857
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Posted: 25 June 2006 at 7:01pm | IP Logged | 8
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"however to condemn a work that has yet to even be release, well I don't know"
Previous chapters to the book have already been released in past years.
I've read some of the pages and it's morose, creepy stuff.
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Casey Sager Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 761
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Posted: 25 June 2006 at 7:02pm | IP Logged | 9
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I can't believe people would defend him either. I also can't believe the mindset that would be interested in seeing Dorothy from the Wizard of friggin Oz getting her kitty licked. What the hell is wrong with these people???
Casey
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Matt Reed Byrne Robotics Security
Robotmod
Joined: 16 April 2004 Posts: 36364
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Posted: 25 June 2006 at 7:24pm | IP Logged | 10
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Rance Johnson wrote:
Just because Luke Cage, or any other character, was originally created as an all ages character, it doesn't mean that other versions of that character can't be explored. Especially not just because you don't like it. There are plenty of people out there who do after all. Who are you to decide for them what kind of content they should read? I would also point out that when something like anal sex occurs with a character, then that character is no longer an "all ages" character. it is a character written for and (ideally) intended for an adult audience. |
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Quite simply, that's bullshit. Luke Cage. Entire history=all-ages, mainstream superhero. One, count 'em, one comic he is depicted having anal sex with another character. Then he returns to being an all-ages, mainstream superhero. He's not an adult character. He's not intended to be written for adults except for one issue. An issue that uses an all-ages-friggin' character to depict a sexual act. No reason, at all, to do this save that someone thought it'd be cool to write about a superhero having anal sex and how that would play on the mind of the character with whom he was having sex with. I read the issue, Rance, and I feel comfortable enough with my position with regard to all-ages, mainstream superheroes to say that it was wrong. Black and white. Plain and simple. You don't like it? Tough.
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Chris Davids Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 25 June 2006 Posts: 5
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Posted: 25 June 2006 at 7:42pm | IP Logged | 11
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"And on that front, Moore stuck characters he didn't own into a porno book! I, too, can't believe someone can even begin to defend him!!!"
At least in the US they are all character in the public domain so I don't see the problem. Seriously, I'll defend him. He's a writer and this is the story he chose to write. No one is going to be forced to read it or look at it. Moore has even explained why he chose these characters. He sees their experiences as a good metaphor for sexual awakening. You may not like it, you may find it down right deplorable but it is his right to write this story.
And no I don't care about his stance on his works in Hollywood. Alan Moore is not writing a GN adaptation of Lewis Carrol's Alice Through the Looking Glass or Barrie's "Peter Pan and Wendy". I'm all for creative freedom and I am completely against censorship. The fact that so many people here don't seem to be is a bit sad.
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Jim O'Neill Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 12 April 2005 Posts: 336
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Posted: 25 June 2006 at 7:42pm | IP Logged | 12
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Iron Balls wrote: "If he changed all the names and the characterizations so they were completely new, and not recognizable as avatars of those classic characters, would they even be mildly interesting stories?"
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IMO, that's it in an iron nutshell. A good story should be able to stand on its own, without having to rely on the reader's knowledge of a second writer's work. The type of story being told here (according to what Alan Moore said in the BBC interview) could have been done using characters created by Moore. All this coming of age stuff (whether sexual or not) has been done before, by writers who relied on their own ingenuity to make it work.
Merely aging a group of characters created by others~ characters whose appeal (and magic) disappears the moment you write them as adults~ is nothing more than a gimmick.
IMO, if you've got a mature story to tell and you want to tell it in comic book form (like "Maus", or "Fax From Sarajevo"), then you just tell it. You don't waste time trying to shoehorn a superhero into your work. It's unnecessary, and it diminishes the story you're telling.
By the same token, taking super heroes~ or little girls from children's fantasy books~ and saddling them with "real world" problems, revelations and realizations diminishes those stories and drags the characters down. They weren't created to be able to handle it.
They don't mix well because they were never intended to. Put them together and you end up with something less; both types of storytelling diluted by the presence of the other.
IMO.
Edited by Jim O'Neill on 25 June 2006 at 7:45pm
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