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Brian Miller
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Joined: 28 July 2004
Location: United States
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| Posted: 17 January 2021 at 12:36pm | IP Logged | 1
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beyond time... beyond place...
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Peter Hicks
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 30 April 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 1986
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| Posted: 17 January 2021 at 3:21pm | IP Logged | 2
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In his recent FF mini series, Neal Adams consistently drew Ben with teeth. And it looked totally wrong.
Should Ben have visible teeth when his mouth is wide open? Discuss.
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Michael Roberts
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Joined: 20 April 2004
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| Posted: 17 January 2021 at 3:40pm | IP Logged | 3
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Doug Centers
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Joined: 17 February 2014
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| Posted: 17 January 2021 at 3:53pm | IP Logged | 4
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I think, like little eyes on Wolverine or Spider-Man's masks an artist may use teeth on Ben to convey a certain feel.
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Marc Baptiste
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Joined: 17 June 2004
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| Posted: 17 January 2021 at 3:56pm | IP Logged | 5
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I think the issue of drawing teeth in comics is broader then just should the THING be drawn with teeth when his mouth is open.
It takes a very skilled artist (like our master host) to pull off drawing teeth in artwork that is initially drawn on large tabloid size paper then reduced many times and printed on something slightly smaller then 8.5 X11.
I have noticed a bit of a trend lately in comic book art where artists attempt to draw a mouthful of teeth in hyper detail and the final shrunk down printed product is downright "scary" looking. I don't think it ever looks good to draw ever single tooth in an open or partially open character's mouth unless perhaps you are rendering a very large image of the face on in splash page or full page spread type situation.
Marc
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Jason Scott
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Joined: 06 August 2012
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| Posted: 17 January 2021 at 3:57pm | IP Logged | 6
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This is one of the many reasons why I love this place. Finding out such behind the scenes details to my favourite stories. I always thought the Beyonder in that issue seemed a little too wise. So it makes sense now to learn that he was effectively stealing the Doctor's role and 'voice' for the end of the tale.
He was much more the impetuous dangerous figure that he should have been in the Dr Doom story. (I always loved Reed's speech about how even the Beyonder should not dare messing with the paradoxes of time..)
And yeah, I do like the starfish comparison for the Thing. JB's take on Ben is probably my all time favourite..
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John Byrne
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Joined: 11 May 2005
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| Posted: 17 January 2021 at 5:05pm | IP Logged | 7
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I draw the Thing with teeth, depending on the angle.
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Eric Sofer
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Joined: 31 January 2014
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| Posted: 18 January 2021 at 9:58am | IP Logged | 8
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I do SO love Mr. Byrne's Benjamin J. It is TREMENDOUS, and no modern artist can even polish Mr. B's shoes.
But if I pick my favorite Thing, then Mr. Byrne is a razor's edge behind Jack Kirby and Joe Sinnott. Of course, the differences are barely tangible anyhow; but my #1 is Mr. Kirby and Mr. Sinnott. No offense, Mr. Byrne.
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Mark Waldman
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Joined: 16 August 2006
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| Posted: 18 January 2021 at 10:05am | IP Logged | 9
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Not adding anything too revolutionary but imo, JB's FF is his high water mark. Such a wonderful time to be a youngish fan. I love all JB's work but the writing and art effort on Marvel's first family is the best imo. If Marvel wants to figure out how to do a successful FF film finally, they should go to the source material - Stan and Jack or JB. Of course, we all know how the film efforts turn out.
Thanks for all the genius on FF, JB.
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Robert Bradley
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Joined: 20 September 2006
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| Posted: 18 January 2021 at 10:53am | IP Logged | 10
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Obviously Ben would have teeth, so it's not wrong to draw him with them, it's just that usually you don't see them.
But there will be times that drawing him with them showing will give the art a little extra "umph" when showing emotion.
My problems with Neal Adams' version of Ben Grimm is that he draws them with teeth in almost every panel, plus he always gives him too much muscular definition (he gives him abs, which just doesn't look right to me).
Edited by Robert Bradley on 18 January 2021 at 10:58am
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Adam Schulman
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Joined: 22 July 2017
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| Posted: 18 January 2021 at 1:37pm | IP Logged | 11
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"I don’t think anyone is suggesting that the Thing is literally shaped like a starfish, so I don’t understand this argument. I thought the starfish thing was just a guide to avoid drawing the Thing with human or simian proportions."
Yes. Exactly my point. I should've said "as John Byrne once said..."
And the Neal Adams panel posted by Robert gets precisely at what I was trying to say. Adams is a brilliant artist but he draws the Thing totally wrong. Ben is just not shaped like a muscular human but with orange-rock skin. I don't get why Adams isn't drawing him correctly. Is it a conscious choice?
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Wallace Sellars
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Joined: 01 May 2004
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Posts: 17700
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| Posted: 18 January 2021 at 4:47pm | IP Logged | 12
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Not many people get Ben right, but Alan Davis is on the short list...
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