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Robbie Parry Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 June 2007 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 12186
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Posted: 07 February 2018 at 8:12am | IP Logged | 1
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Leigh DJ Hunt wrote:
Isn't that just throwing more space junk into our atmosphere? |
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Grumpy though I felt, I said the same to a Facebook friend.
I worry about a future where we'll be littering more and more of space.
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Stephen Churay Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 March 2009 Location: United States Posts: 8369
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Posted: 07 February 2018 at 8:13am | IP Logged | 2
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Right now, is there anyone on this planet as revered as Elon Musk?
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Neil Lindholm Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005 Location: China Posts: 4946
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Posted: 07 February 2018 at 8:17am | IP Logged | 3
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QUOTE:
I worry about a future where we'll be littering more and more of space. |
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Again, the car will not stay in orbit but will head out towards Mars. Also, it is not in a geosynchronous orbit so even if they left it where it is now, it would soon burn up in the atmosphere.
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Robbie Parry Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 June 2007 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 12186
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Posted: 07 February 2018 at 8:29am | IP Logged | 4
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So we're littering Mars instead? ;-)
(To avoid doubt, the smiley means I am not entirely being grumpy, just a light-hearted discussion).
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Eric Ladd Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 August 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 4505
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Posted: 07 February 2018 at 8:42am | IP Logged | 5
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It was an amazing achievement, but not without errors. I am extremely impressed by what they accomplished and for me the pinnacle is seeing those two boosters land safely back on the surface of the planet. However, space travel is so far out of the realm of my financial possibilities that I will remain a kid with face pressed firmly against the window looking in for most likely the rest of my life. It's still effing amazing though.
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Eric Ladd Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 August 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 4505
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Posted: 07 February 2018 at 8:45am | IP Logged | 6
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Looking at some of the photos plastering the internet right now I guess the flat Earth idiots must think Musk is also part of the plot to keep truth from the people. I almost look forward to hearing the convoluted "logic" that will be used to explain how Musk is motivated to perpetuate a round Earth lie!! =)
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Eric Sofer Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 January 2014 Location: United States Posts: 4789
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Posted: 07 February 2018 at 9:42am | IP Logged | 7
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We are sort of littering our sky (and Mars' too, I guess.) But I'm thinking of the future, and considering that it's not litter... it's planting supplies in orbit to someday be harvested when such "junk" is no longer of practical use to us. I imagine orbiting junk-collectors, picking up material that is far easier to obtain than having to boost it from Earth surface to space stations, etc.
One century's junk is another century's treasure, perhaps. I like to think so.
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Conrad Teves Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 January 2014 Location: United States Posts: 2230
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Posted: 07 February 2018 at 10:28am | IP Logged | 8
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Some things worth pondering:
No one asked SpaceX to develop Falcon Heavy, the most powerful rocket in the world by a factor of two. It was paid for by SpaceX's own money. An astonishingly small half billion dollars. (SLS, by comparison has absorbed $11+Bn and flown nothing, with a projected $ 5Bn per flight). As this was just a test flight and had no customer, they launched Elon's personal car (instead of a "mass simulant"--dead weight) into space because it amused Elon. They originally intended to send it out Mars orbit, but it looks like they ran the tanks dry and its going to the asteroid belt instead. Why? As astronomer Phil Plait wisely points out, because they felt like it. No Act of Congress, no decade-long government/industry partnership, just a spur of the moment decision. That's a real mindset-changer from those who thought colonizing Mars was going to be done with a team of Four Elite Men. As for the future of the car, someone ran the integration of the orbit out 10,000 years (yay, internet!), and it appears that the car's orbit will become progressively elongated, and will start to be perturbed by Jupiter more and more over time--there's a fair chance it will be ejected from the solar system altogether. Starman indeed! SpaceX's next vehicle will actually be able to collect Space Junk, among many other cooler things.
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Kevin Brown Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 31 May 2005 Location: United States Posts: 9006
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Posted: 07 February 2018 at 10:48am | IP Logged | 9
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So we're littering Mars instead? ;-)
***************************
Opening a car dealership.
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Eric Ladd Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 August 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 4505
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Posted: 07 February 2018 at 11:16am | IP Logged | 10
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Conrad Teves wrote:
they launched Elon's personal car (instead of a "mass simulant"--dead weight) into space because it amused Elon. |
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Conrad, that made me think of every High School/University prank involving the relocation of a teacher's or administrator's car. Very cool and funny.
Edited by Eric Ladd on 07 February 2018 at 3:38pm
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Erin Anna Leach Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 February 2006 Location: United States Posts: 746
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Posted: 07 February 2018 at 1:37pm | IP Logged | 11
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Rod Collins posted :A guy who manufactures "environmentally friendly" electric cars uses a bucket load of fossil fuels to launch a car into space. Odd.
**************************************************Rod here are the components of Rocket fuel. Ammonium perchlorate, the salt of perchloric acid and ammonia, is a powerful oxidizer (read: majorly explosive). In the boosters, the aluminum powder and ammonium perchlorate are held together by a binder, polybutadiene acrylonitrile, or PBAN. Where is the fossil fuel here?
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Conrad Teves Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 January 2014 Location: United States Posts: 2230
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Posted: 07 February 2018 at 2:15pm | IP Logged | 12
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>>Where is the fossil fuel here? <<
That's for solid rocket boosters like the Space Shuttle used (the exact components, in fact.)
Falcon 9 and Falcon Heavy's "Merlin" engines use RP-1 (tidied-up Kerosene) and LOX (liquid oxygen).
The BFR "Raptor" engines (next on SpaceX's design list) will use liquid methane (because you can make it on Mars) and LOX.
As for the pollution caused, RP-1/LOX burns to CO2 and water as does methane/LOX. Any realistic volume they could burn with even a busy space industry would be tiny compared to the airline industry or gas cars. I.e., the planet is currently burning 35 billion barrels of oil per year.
Also, there's no special reason methane production could not be made carbon-neutral (on Earth, anyway). In fact there's research to make one think it would only made that way in the near future.
As for electric rockets, the only design I've ever seen was designed by none other than Robert Bussard (I'll see if I can find the paper somewhere), and required a nuclear fusion reactor to electrically heat air as reaction mass.
Edited by Conrad Teves on 07 February 2018 at 2:27pm
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