| Author |
|
Sergio Saavedra
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 13 August 2007
Location: Spain
Posts: 452
|
| Posted: 30 January 2018 at 8:05am | IP Logged | 1
|
post reply
|
|
JB's Superman would be great right now. Even just a slight modernization of Siegel & Shuster's Superman would be great today.I'm very glad John Byrne made the alleged "mistakes" he says he made.
Edited by Sergio Saavedra on 30 January 2018 at 8:05am
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Noah Smith
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 29 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 1217
|
| Posted: 30 January 2018 at 8:15am | IP Logged | 2
|
post reply
|
|
I know JB wasn't the only person who expressed interest in doing the overhaul of Superman that DC had decided on in the 80s. I would love to hear what some of the other ideas were. I would imagine most people would have made much more drastic changes than JB did.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
Ted Pugliese
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 05 December 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 7984
|
| Posted: 30 January 2018 at 2:42pm | IP Logged | 3
|
post reply
|
|
Great thread! Two things.
#1. I liked not having Superboy because I was a big
fan of the movie Superman and didn't think "he" was
necessary. Moreover, the Legion could have been just
as easily inspired by, or even MORE reasonably
inspired by, Superman (and the Justice League) than by
Superboy. This should have been a non-issue. If DC
was going to do away with Superboy, then he couldn't
be/have been in the Legion (duh). Same for Supergirl.
In fact, she had just died. To bring her back in the
post-crisis universe would have been to undermine her
death. Therefore, as much as I enjoyed both stories,
I think the pocket universe and new Supergil stories
were both unnecessary, and no surprise, I loved JB's
Superman as well as his approach.
#2. Sometimes I wonder what we would have gotten if
DC went in the opposite direction. That is, following
Kara's death and Crisis. Kal-El decides/realizes that
he is finished "wasting time" with his Clark Kent
disguise and becomes Superman fully. No more Clark,
no more Lois, no more Daily Planet & Metropolis. Just
Superman, above all, possibly getting involved with
Wonder Woman, more active with the JLA (or less?),
living at the Fortress, etc, but dedicated to
protecting Earth and the universe, in light of the
Crisis. Maybe even killing Darkseid the next time he
dared to threaten his adopted home or the universe,
since he was beyond or outside the laws of man, which
Superman would still respect.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
Lars Sandmark
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 05 October 2007
Location: Canada
Posts: 3144
|
| Posted: 30 January 2018 at 8:08pm | IP Logged | 4
|
post reply
|
|
John Byrne was already my favourite comicbook artist for years when he did Man Of Steel, so I was thrilled to see his take on Superman, and loved the work that he did with the titles.
But biased or not, those issues are top notch comicbooks, especially compared to todays offerings.
It's nothing new that some anonymous internet blogger tries to create site visits by pissing on something/someone.
JB's Superman stuff is solid.
All of JB's stuff is notches above other people's stuff, so even if something he has done isn't as well regarded as some of his other work, its still better than pretty much everyone else's.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132638
|
| Posted: 30 January 2018 at 8:25pm | IP Logged | 5
|
post reply
|
|
All of JB's stuff is notches above other people's stuff...••• Not all!
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Jim Petersman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 26 June 2012
Location: United States
Posts: 638
|
| Posted: 30 January 2018 at 10:06pm | IP Logged | 6
|
post reply
|
|
The author should focus on what DC was doing at that time. DC, if I recall correctly, had such a golden opportunity. There was a mass exodus of talent from Marvel and real energy buzzing about during Crisis (Worlds will live, worlds will die, and the DC universe will never be the same) which then had the lamest ending possible (let's clean up this multiverse mess by keeping all of these characters around that remember the multiverse).
I think the original plan was just to blow it all up and start fresh with a...um..uh..New Universe. That would have been just fine! But then DC seemed to waffle with throwing out anything that was even mildly successful pre-Crisis and we ended up with a muddy, incoherent mess. Some titles were completely revamped, others barely noticed that there was a Crisis.
Now we have to explain a Wonder Girl existing before a Wonder Woman. Now we have to create a Pocket Superboy to keep the past stories "real". Now we have to create new origins for previous Kryptonian characters. There was way too much effort being put into figuring out how to keep the past alive (in the stories themselves) when there should have been a laser like focus on (talent) creating the future. Maybe someday someone will go back and get it right (and then never do it again).
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132638
|
| Posted: 30 January 2018 at 10:49pm | IP Logged | 7
|
post reply
|
|
I think the original plan was just to blow it all up and start fresh with a...um..uh..New Universe. That would have been just fine! But then DC seemed to waffle with throwing out anything that was even mildly successful pre-Crisis and we ended up with a muddy, incoherent mess. Some titles were completely revamped, others barely noticed that there was a Crisis. ••• I suppose I will always remember Dick Giordano painting the Big Picture for me, telling me everything DC hoped to accomplish, including wiping away all the parallel universes "except the one with Captain Carrot."
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Vinny Valenti
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 8071
|
| Posted: 31 January 2018 at 8:23am | IP Logged | 8
|
post reply
|
|
"(let's clean up this multiverse mess by keeping all of these characters around that remember the multiverse)"
---
DC was/is very split-brained. They go through the trouble coordinating events to explain planned changes in continuity ("Everything matters!") but when they botch it and people question how the dots actually connect, they come back with "The details don't matter!". Which is it?
I still don't understand how the Flash going back in time and changing history turns Wally West Black.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132638
|
| Posted: 31 January 2018 at 1:41pm | IP Logged | 9
|
post reply
|
|
When I accepted the Superman assignment I assumed I would pick up the next issue in the schedule and proceed to introduce my "fix" in continuity. But CRISIS had taught DC how to blow things up, and courtesy of new Mac computers appearing in all the editorial offices, the word "reboot" was on everyone's lips. So a reboot was what they wanted. So a reboot is what I gave them. In all honesty, I still think my original plan would have worked better. It was easier to just start over from scratch, but an internal, in continuity fix, however radical, would have better placated the more rabid fans.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Robbie Parry
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 June 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 12186
|
| Posted: 31 January 2018 at 1:52pm | IP Logged | 10
|
post reply
|
|
Having enjoyed the MOS story at the time, and many times since, I am sorry to hear about rabid fans, judgement, etc. It seems a shame.
I know everyone has their tastes, but I persuaded a "civilian" to read MOS. She liked it.
And I think it holds up well. Very well. EVERY work of fiction will always become dated as far as fashions and hairstyles go. That's unavoidable. But it does NOT detract from the enjoyment. From the interpretation of Krypton to, well, everything, I think MOS has stood the test of time.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132638
|
| Posted: 31 January 2018 at 2:36pm | IP Logged | 11
|
post reply
|
|
Another mistake I made was not letting them list my version as "Superman III" in WHO'S WHO. They really wanted to, but I insisted that my version should not be cut off from the original character in this way. If I'd allowed it, tho, it would probably have muted a lot of the whiners.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Robbie Parry
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 June 2007
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 12186
|
| Posted: 31 January 2018 at 3:11pm | IP Logged | 12
|
post reply
|
|
John Byrne wrote:
| Another mistake I made was not letting them list my version as "Superman III" in WHO'S WHO. |
|
|
I'm not quite sure how to articulate this, Mr Byrne, but I wonder if WHO'S WHO? and OHOTMU are, even if only a small way, a part of what went wrong with fandom wanting to know everything and cross every t/dot every i.
Not blaming it exclusively, but wondered if it contributed to the "archaeology" mindset.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
