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Kip Lewis
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 March 2011
Posts: 2880
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| Posted: 15 January 2015 at 6:24pm | IP Logged | 1
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Marvel and DC did a Spider-Man Batman
crossover that occurred in a shared
universe. It was their first encounter
and Spider-man was totally in awe of
Batman. Total respect for him. Maybe even
a little fan boy. Been a while since I
read it. They didn't fight.
http://www.amazon.com/Spider-Man-Batman-
Disordered-Minds-DeMatteis/dp/0785101926
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132663
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| Posted: 15 January 2015 at 9:07pm | IP Logged | 2
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I'm right with you in so far as Superman vs ASM was a more natural, more accessible and simply better approach than the over-thinking of JLA/Avengers... but the latter does mean Batman would not HAVE to share a universe with Spider-Man in order for them to meet. ••• But, unless you're a fan writing strictly for fans, why complicate matters? SUPERMAN vs THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN can be read by ANYBODY. If you just woke up from a hibernation that began in the 19th Century, you can pick up SvASM, read it, and by the last page you will know who those people were and why they were doing those horrible things to each other. No need for cosmic portals and establishing parallel Earths have different masses, or any of the other bull that gets shoveled into comics these days so writers can answer the whiny fan questions they asked themselves when they were whiny fans! And most of all, if the question is who would win in a fight between two characters, it negates the whole exercise if both characters do not start on the same level playing field. In other words, they've heard of each other, each has some sense of how the other operates.
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Wallace Sellars
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 May 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 17678
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| Posted: 15 January 2015 at 9:26pm | IP Logged | 3
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Michael, I think I recall reading that!
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Brian O'Neill
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 13 November 2013
Location: United States
Posts: 1964
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| Posted: 16 January 2015 at 1:59am | IP Logged | 4
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Even the X-MEN AND TEEN TITANS had one of the characters(I want to say Cyborg), thinking about how both groups have operated in New York for so long, but haven't met...kind of getting right, and then wrong, in the same sentence!
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Michael Penn
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 April 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 12566
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| Posted: 16 January 2015 at 6:49am | IP Logged | 5
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I have a seven year old boy, and "who wins?" can be a thrilling albeit momentary question for him. He asks, can get an answer, and it does NOT need to be definitive, and he's okay with whatever might be the response and then very happily goes back to comicbooks (the classics I read with him, nothing new), which rarely feature sheer slugfests and never lack a precisely structured setting that emphasizes 100% the story instead of trying to vainly render some abstract battle of two respective characters' powers as they might be on paper.
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Kip Lewis
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 March 2011
Posts: 2880
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| Posted: 16 January 2015 at 8:20am | IP Logged | 6
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Since crisscrossing dimensions has been a
part of comics since the 60s, I don't see
it as convoluted or hard. DC regularly
had JSA/JLA meetings, Marvel had their
own. And My fifth grade mind had no
problem understanding it. Shoot my 2nd
grade mind partially understood FF's
"Things of Two Worlds" where three earth
are at war caused by a fourth world under
Arkon's hand. Even the parts I didn't get
didn't stop me and my friend from enjoying
it.
Was JLA/Avengers written for the fans
based on heavy continuity? Yeah, Busiek
said it was. He did that for a reason. He
knew Marvel was changing their approach to
writing so that previous storylines and
characterizations don't matter. Writers
can tell whatever they want and history
isn't important. He wanted to give the
fans one last ride with the pre-Quesada
stories and characters.
Edited by Kip Lewis on 16 January 2015 at 8:45am
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
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| Posted: 16 January 2015 at 9:09am | IP Logged | 7
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Since crisscrossing dimensions has been a part of comics since the 60s, I don't see it as convoluted or hard.•• The actual mechanics of it, no. But, again, level playing field. If we ask who would win, Spider-Man or Batman, then BOTH must be operating in their usual environment. NEITHER can be at any sort of disadvantage, such as being in a different dimension (which, btw, is not the kind of story Batman or Spider-Man should be in to begin with!). ++++ Was JLA/Avengers written for the fans based on heavy continuity? Yeah, Busiek said it was. He did that for a reason. He knew Marvel was changing their approach to writing so that previous storylines and characterizations don't matter. Writers can tell whatever they want and history isn't important. He wanted to give the fans one last ride with the pre-Quesada stories and characters. •• SUPERMAN vs THE AMAZING SPIDER-MAN featured those "pre-Quesada" characters, as did the crossovers that followed before JLA/AVENGERS. Had the JLA/AVENGERS story been set in that same "universe," those fans would have had that "last ride" without any anal-retentive gobbledegook gumming up the works.
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Brian O'Neill
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 13 November 2013
Location: United States
Posts: 1964
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| Posted: 16 January 2015 at 9:48am | IP Logged | 8
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And thanks to Jim Shooter, we never got to see the 1983, pre-Crisis, 'pre-Quesada' version of JLA-AVENGERS:
Edited by Brian O'Neill on 16 January 2015 at 9:49am
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Brad Krawchuk
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 June 2006
Location: Canada
Posts: 5819
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| Posted: 16 January 2015 at 9:58am | IP Logged | 9
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I've said it before, I'll say it again - CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS and JLA/AVENGERS are two so-so stories elevated to greatness by spectacular art.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132663
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| Posted: 16 January 2015 at 10:31am | IP Logged | 10
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CRISIS ON INFINITE EARTHS and JLA/AVENGERS are two so-so stories elevated to greatness by spectacular art. •• True dat!
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Jim Petersman
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 26 June 2012
Location: United States
Posts: 638
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| Posted: 16 January 2015 at 11:00am | IP Logged | 11
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What I find most interesting in the story Brian linked to is a pissed off George Perez! If "the nicest man in comics" calls you an asshole in the press, well, you may want to reevaluate the way you're living your life.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132663
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| Posted: 16 January 2015 at 11:52am | IP Logged | 12
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One of the most disturbing things about that linked articLe is this response:"And 1 more thing,The Hell with contracts,they mean absolutely nothing,its just a piece of paper with writing on it." That makes me sad in more ways than I can count.
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Topic Closed)
