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Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
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| Posted: 08 April 2014 at 6:35pm | IP Logged | 1
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My points are:
- Frank Cho may hate Superman, but at least he is not a hypocrite.
- Comic books are more than just a product with a price tag. It's art, which is fueled by the passions of its creators, and feeds the passions of its followers. If we weren't passionate about the subject, we wouldn't even be having this discussion!
- Artists and writers who feel indifferent about their subject matter is perfectly normal. Those who actually hate the characters they work with should have nothing to do with it.
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James Howell
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 23 September 2012
Location: United States
Posts: 363
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| Posted: 08 April 2014 at 7:11pm | IP Logged | 2
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Didn't John Buscema say he hated drawing superheroes? Did it affect his work? What separates professionals from amateurs, is that pros can be called upon to draw things they might not like, but still produce quality work. Amateurs only draw what the LIKE to draw, never stretching out to draw things they can't. Hate to break the news to you, but plenty of artists do jobs, they're not thrilled with, but they do the best they can for their clients.
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Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
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| Posted: 08 April 2014 at 7:49pm | IP Logged | 3
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What John Buscema didn't do was ridicule and belittle his subject matter on the printed page. He was a professional. Now think back to all the trash Marvel has produced in the past decade or two. A chauvinist Captain America (Ultimates). A traitorous Iron Man (Civil War). A defeatist Captain America (again Civil War). A mind-raped Spider-Man (Superior Spider-Man). Now I'm sure all the creators involved with these books will behave like Andrew Farago's archetypal modern creator: proclaim great fondness for these characters when asked, collect paycheck, proceed to the next deconstructionist project. But their attitude towards the characters shows. It's right there in the stories. What's worse, OUR true feelings towards the characters shows, when we excuse these creators, their stories, and keep on buying their stuff by the truckloads.
Edited by Joe Zhang on 08 April 2014 at 7:52pm
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Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 14857
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| Posted: 08 April 2014 at 7:59pm | IP Logged | 4
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Now I'm sure all the creators involved with these books will behave like Andrew Farago's archetypal modern creator
-----
You seem anxious to pick a fight over something that wasn't said.
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Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
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| Posted: 08 April 2014 at 8:46pm | IP Logged | 5
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I do feel a bit anxious. Perhaps I should go visit a sex-worker.
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David Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Posts: 3093
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| Posted: 08 April 2014 at 9:02pm | IP Logged | 6
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Joe, you should tweet that.
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Matt Reed
Byrne Robotics Security
Robotmod
Joined: 16 April 2004
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| Posted: 08 April 2014 at 10:41pm | IP Logged | 7
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The "sex-worker" thing is odd, I'll give you that. Sorry, but it sounds too PC for me. But the connection drawn between some of the crap put out by the Big Two and what Frank Cho has said is confusing to me. What's better? Someone who states exactly how they feel and has said that they would never work on a specific character that they actually dislike or the person that smiles, nods and gives the fans the soundbite they want to hear all the while loathing the work that they are doing on a character that they despise? Someone who takes a job on a property they hate (and let's be real, they're all properties) and decides that the only way they can enjoy the work is to twist it into something unrecognizable? Instead of applauding a person who says they can't work on Superman because the character doesn't speak to them, they're slammed as part of the problem? Five page on...that?
Wow.
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James Howell
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 23 September 2012
Location: United States
Posts: 363
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| Posted: 08 April 2014 at 10:53pm | IP Logged | 8
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"Instead of applauding a person who says they can't work on Superman because the character doesn't speak to them, they're slammed as part of the problem? Five page on...that?"
Thank you.
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Robert White
Byrne Robotics Member
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| Posted: 08 April 2014 at 11:01pm | IP Logged | 9
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I'm firmly on the side of the creators who refuse to work with characters they don't like. I've never expected creative teams to always be rapid fan's at heart, but some appreciating, if not admiration, is needed or things can get very cynical, very fast.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but doesn't JB refuses to do commissions featuring certain characters that he doesn't like?
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Matt Reed
Byrne Robotics Security
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| Posted: 08 April 2014 at 11:10pm | IP Logged | 10
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Joe Zhang wrote:
| Comic books are more than just a product with a price tag. |
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No. They're not. We as fans may elevate them to more than they are. We may laud them for speaking to something that may never have been spoken about in the medium. We may talk about the nuance of an artistic line, be it with pen or a word. We may debate the intricacies of a convoluted mythology and a continuity that would drive the normal person batty. But at the end of the day every single comic book, every single series and every single character is a product with a price tag. Comics is a business. That they occasionally elevate themselves above and beyond a product to be bought and sold is a plus. The same can be said for anything. Books, movies, television, games. You name it. Number one is sales. How can I (personally or a corporation) make money off of that which I create? That we have anything at all that even remotely resembles artistic integrity is the same issue that plagued the likes of Michelangelo, Shakespeare and Arthur Miller among many, many, many others.
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Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 14857
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| Posted: 08 April 2014 at 11:21pm | IP Logged | 11
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The "sex-worker" thing is odd, I'll give you that. Sorry, but it sounds too PC for me.
----
What's odd is that people think that "sex worker" was the point of my original comment, as if it was somehow an entreaty not to use the word prostitute. You can say prostitute, people. That wasn't what my comment was about.
Edited by Michael Roberts on 08 April 2014 at 11:28pm
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Matt Reed
Byrne Robotics Security
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| Posted: 08 April 2014 at 11:22pm | IP Logged | 12
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Not the way it read to me, but thanks!
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Topic Closed)
