| Author |
|
Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 14857
|
| Posted: 09 April 2014 at 2:41pm | IP Logged | 1
|
|
|
Has someone said it matters? Genuine question, because following this thread I feel like there's a huge disconnect.
----
Yes.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Peter Hicks
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 30 April 2004
Location: Canada
Posts: 1969
|
| Posted: 09 April 2014 at 2:47pm | IP Logged | 2
|
|
|
I get the feeling most folks on this message board are not fond of Grant Morrison, but he talks of the many writers who say they don't know what stories to tell with Superman because he is too powerful. Grant says he thinks of Superman's challenges as allegories; they are the same as any hero's challenges, they are just 1,000 times harder. So for example, when he has to walk his dog, it's a superdog, and he has to walk it around the solar system. And when Superman's unwanted relatives come for the holidays, they are 7 dimensional beings from a quantum future that may not ever exist. And so on. Grant's All Star Superman was an amazing series. And I can't recall the last thing that Frank Cho did that I liked.
Edited by Peter Hicks on 09 April 2014 at 2:48pm
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Carmen Bernardo
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 August 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 3666
|
| Posted: 09 April 2014 at 3:15pm | IP Logged | 3
|
|
|
Jason Czeskleba wrote:
| In general, Kirby had no interest in working on any characters that had been created by someone else, and at DC he only did so when specifically asked by Carmine Infantino. From what I've read, he viewed it as a challenge to work on a character he was uninterested in, rather than declining assignments if he didn't like a character. But I doubt Kirby would have been asked to do Batman stories at that point, since the character seems a poor match for his skill set. |
|
|
Thank you for clearing that up. I didn't have the article on hand, but I did recall that Kirby had those kinds of feelings about doing the DC characters. He seemed a bit reluctant to be doing Superman's Pal, Jimmy Olsen during his Fourth World stint. When you consider that they had someone redraw Supe's face in those comics, you could see why.
I guess I transposed Steve Ditko over Kirby here in my fuzzy memory, as there have been statements made to the effect that he wanted strict "good guy versus bad guy" ethics expressed through the stories that he drew.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Andrew W. Farago
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 July 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 4079
|
| Posted: 09 April 2014 at 3:50pm | IP Logged | 4
|
|
|
Artists work on characters that aren't their favorites all the time. They probably even work on characters whose designs they really can't stand (or who only seem to work when the original artist draws them). If you're a true professional, fans won't be able to tell the difference. If Frank Cho draws an issue of Superman, it will look just as good as when he draws an issue of Wolverine, and even if you were aware that he didn't like the character, you'd forget about that two or three pages into the story.
Every artist who works on any sort of regular basis has to have a least favorite character, doesn't he? If a job's going to pay the bills and isn't going to make you absolutely miserable the whole time you're doing it, you're not going to say "this really wouldn't be fair to Superman; you should give this assignment to someone else," you're going to take the job, do your best on it, and try to get more work from that editor in the future.
It shows a fundamental lack of understanding about work-for-hire to think that every single artist out there is working on his dream project every single month.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
James Howell
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 23 September 2012
Location: United States
Posts: 363
|
| Posted: 09 April 2014 at 5:01pm | IP Logged | 5
|
|
|
"It shows a fundamental lack of understanding about work-for-hire to think that every single artist out there is working on his dream project every single month."
That fundamental lack of understanding comes from a fan mindset, not a professional one. Most fans think that the artist has to feel the same way about these characters,as they do, to produce quality work. "Why don't you love these heroes like I do?!?" Just like sports fans thinking that if the athletes' confidence doesn't live and die on every single bad pitch, missed shot, dropped ball, etc, then they don't care about winning. The athlete is now just an overpaid PROSTITUTE.
Sound familiar?
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Andrew W. Farago
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 July 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 4079
|
| Posted: 09 April 2014 at 5:23pm | IP Logged | 6
|
|
|
Nobody wants to draw NFL SuperPro, but it's a paying job, and if you do well on it, you might get a better assignment next time an editor's up against a deadline and remembers the guy that knocked out a pretty good NFL SuperPro script over the course of a weekend, or the artist who did a really professional job without complaint despite it being a goofy licensed comic. Maybe that leads to an Avengers book later on, maybe it leads to more NFL SuperPros. But the artist who insists on being passionate about every single project he works on is going to spend more time staring at the phone than he will at the drawing board.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
Anthony J Lombardi
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 9410
|
| Posted: 09 April 2014 at 5:27pm | IP Logged | 7
|
|
|
I'd jump at doing NFL SuperPro. For exactly the reasons Andrew stated.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133328
|
| Posted: 09 April 2014 at 5:27pm | IP Logged | 8
|
|
|
Instead of applauding a person who says they can't work on Superman because the character doesn't speak to them, they're slammed as part of the problem? Five page on...that?••• Here's where the line is for me: as has been already noted in this thread, I don't care for Thanos and actively dislike the Legion of Superheroes. But I've drawn both, the former in commissions, the latter in DC comics. What I haven't done is drawings of any of those characters in, shall we say, inappropriate situations. (Thanos getting his butt kicked by Darkseid or Dark Phoenix? Sure. Because that's what would happen!)
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Andrew W. Farago
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 July 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 4079
|
| Posted: 09 April 2014 at 5:35pm | IP Logged | 9
|
|
|
And Frank Cho probably moved himself to the bottom of the Superman office's call list by doing his Dark Knight parody. He's not the first freelancer to burn bridges with a DC, and won't be the first guy to land a job with them after going out of his way not to get on their good side.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
Tim O Neill
Byrne Robotics Security
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 10937
|
| Posted: 09 April 2014 at 6:01pm | IP Logged | 10
|
|
|
Andrew and James - I just don't get your line of thinking as it applies to Frank Cho. You keep repeating that a professional can do a job regardless of his feelings about a character, but all of Frank Cho's work in regard to Superman shows disdain for the character. I get that these are commissions, but since it is posted on his website with his own commentary, it is very much a publicly disseminated work.
This hypothetical situation that he would treat Superman with respect if he worked on the comic book does not jibe with what he is saying. He has said explicitly in his blog that he will not draw the character again. I admire him for his candor and I appreciate he will not work on the book; but by stating he will not work on the character again, he is making the opposite point that you are making. He is saying he cannot remove himself from his dislike of the character and therefore cannot rise above his disdain to draw him again. That's fine - he seems to be very in touch with his tastes and skill set. There is no reason to elevate him to a level he cannot reach.
I agree that the level of professionalism you describe does exist and is exhibited by many other artists, but not Frank Cho in regard to Superman. Your description is closer to JB's approach to commissions and comic book storytelling.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Stephen Churay
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 March 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 8369
|
| Posted: 09 April 2014 at 8:08pm | IP Logged | 11
|
|
|
Curious. Can statements like this as well as his commission work
showing contempt for the character, hurt him as far as getting work?
As some have said, despite negative feelings for a character, a
professional puts that aside and get the job done to the best of his or
her ability. Many storytellers have done it. John Buscema wasn't a fan
of superheroes in general and was vocal about it, but he always did
amazing work even on characters he wasn't fond of.
Would DC editors or the publisher refuse an artist work or look
elsewhere if they knew that artist has treated there flagship character
less than respectful?
If so, then making such a statement is foolish.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Jason Mark Hickok
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 February 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 10472
|
| Posted: 09 April 2014 at 8:13pm | IP Logged | 12
|
|
|
Well it may hurt a Superman editor from giving him a ring. As I said up
thread he isn't a Captain America fan either but has drawn him plenty of
times in various Avengers books. I didn't notice him drawing Captain
America with any less professionalism.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Topic Closed)
