| Author |
|
Matt Hawes
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 16502
|
| Posted: 15 September 2013 at 11:56am | IP Logged | 1
|
|
|
John Byrne wrote:
| ...Paul would take the train into and out of New York every weekday. Same train, same hour, so, naturally, same people. And social groups began to form among those people. "Chat rooms" and "Forums", if you will, but in the real world. But a very specific slice of the real world. Sometimes the associations that developed on the train extended beyond the train, but mostly not... |
|
|
I have another analogy and some thoughts on the matter to offer:
At my shop, I have regular customers come in regularly. Some are weekly, some monthly, some just a few times a year. While I am on a friendly basis with all these regulars -- Most I am on a first-name basis with, in fact -- There are only very few of these people over the years that I had an extended friendship with beyond them coming to buy merchandise from me and having a friendly chat from time to time.
Message boards, though, are interesting in that they are public, but people are communicating from a distance. This makes for an interesting separation from our analogies above. People who see other people on a regular basis, say on a train or at a shop, might eventually develop a limited form of friendship, as they can on a message board, but will usually maintain some sense of decorum.
However, with a message board conversation, sometimes even message board "friendships" can devolve and become nasty more quickly than in face-to-face encounters due to the basic anonymity one has on the internet. People say things they would never dare say, and in a much ruder tone, than they would in person with other people.
On the matter of political and religious threads, for many reasons I refrain from participating in those threads. Rarely do I post in them, and most of the time I do not read the threads. Do I think they shouldn't be on the board because I don't want to participate in them? Not at all. I can and do choose not to participate on threads all the time, and I am not adversely affected in any manner for them being here despite my disinterest.
Avoiding threads is as easy as not clicking a link. Finding a discussion on another board on the site is probably more difficult: It might require TWO clicks! Eeep!
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
John Bodin
Byrne Robotics Member
Purveyor of Rare Items
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3911
|
| Posted: 15 September 2013 at 12:04pm | IP Logged | 2
|
|
|
Thanks for the info on Constantine JB -- I knew about his conversion vision, and I think I knew that what he saw was the "X," but the details didn't stick, and I don't recall seeing Constantine's symbol previously. Very cool.
John Byrne wrote:
| …we wouldn't want people thinking that Jesus was a vampire… •• Altho he DID compel his followers to drink his blood. |
|
|
LOL! I think we've discussed the possible implications of all this previously -- the mind does boggle, doesn't it? :-) BTW, this exchange is a prime example of what I seriously value about this forum -- you are very up-front about being an atheist, but I feel like you personally do a very good job of remaining respectful of the beliefs of others, provided they afford you the same level of respect in return. I also think that you personally are a prime example of what Pope Francis was talking about here: You don't have to believe in God to go to Heaven+ That said, I still have no idea what it takes to get into Asgard (sorry!). ;-)
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Steve De Young
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 April 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 3507
|
| Posted: 15 September 2013 at 12:08pm | IP Logged | 3
|
|
|
JB is dead right about Constantine. The other letter behind is a 'rho'. The symbol is commonly called the Chi-Rho, and is the first two Greek letters in Christos arranged in crosswise fashion. Its still used very commonly as a Christian symbol, and a modified version of it is used by Rome as a symbol of the papal curia.
The other bit, however, about 'stavros' is incorrect. While its true that 'stavros', in Classical Greek, originally meant a torture stake, by the time the New Testament was written in koine Greek, 'stavros' and the verb form, 'stavroo', had come to refer to any method of crucifixion used by the Romans or others. The Romans used a lot of different methods. Crosses sometimes looked like a big X, or were simply a cross beam nailed to a tree, or looked like a '+', or a large capital 'T', or the now more common lower case 't'. Often the upright post was left in place and various bodies and cross beams were nailed to it for executions. So its more correct to say that the Greek of the New Testament is vague regarding what the shape of Jesus' particular cross was.
But the traditional shape now used was part of Christian tradition long before the 5th century. For example, the graffiti below is from Rome, and was drawn in the second century by pagans mocking Christianity. The inscription says, 'Alexamenos worships his god', and depicts a man worshipping a man being crucified with the head of a jackass. This graffiti would seem to prove that already in the second century, the traditional image of Christ being crucified was known to Christians, and even to non-Christians, such that it could be the object of ridicule.
Additionally, when Constantine's mother Helen excavated the place of Christ's crucifixion in 318 she was traditionally said to have found the cross, and from that time on, the traditional image of Christ on the cross is found everywhere in Christendom.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Anthony J Lombardi
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 9410
|
| Posted: 15 September 2013 at 12:30pm | IP Logged | 4
|
|
|
That said, I still have no idea what it takes to get into Asgard (sorry!).~~~~~~~~ You must die a warrior's death In battle
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Matt Hawes
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 16502
|
| Posted: 15 September 2013 at 12:34pm | IP Logged | 5
|
|
|
Anthony, I thought that was how you get to Valhalla, not Asgard, itself?
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133318
|
| Posted: 15 September 2013 at 12:42pm | IP Logged | 6
|
|
|
You don't have to believe in God to go to Heaven•• As I have mentioned elsewhere, I actually LIKE this new Pope. But he's contradicting his Boss there: Matthew 10:32–33 (NIV) 32 “Whoever acknowledges me before others, I will also acknowledge before my Father in heaven. 33 But whoever disowns me before others, I will disown before my Father in heaven.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Anthony J Lombardi
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 9410
|
| Posted: 15 September 2013 at 12:50pm | IP Logged | 7
|
|
|
Anthony, I thought that was how you get to Valhalla, not Asgard, itself? ~~~~~~~~ Sorry Matt I was thinking about Sto'vo'kor ;)
Seriously thou, yes It is Valhalla I was short cutting to make a joke.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133318
|
| Posted: 15 September 2013 at 12:51pm | IP Logged | 8
|
|
|
For example, the graffiti below is from Rome, and was drawn in the second century by pagans mocking Christianity. The inscription says, 'Alexamenos worships his god', and depicts a man worshipping a man being crucified with the head of a jackass. This graffiti would seem to prove that already in the second century, the traditional image of Christ being crucified was known to Christians, and even to non-Christians, such that it could be the object of ridicule.•• Not sure how that image "proves" anything, especially anything related to Christianity. The horse-headed "god" looks to me more as if he has WINGS than is being crucified. (He also appears to be standing on a cross bar, which would rather negate a major element of crucifixion.) Lots of gods were worshipped in the Roman Empire. Contrary to popular imagery, the Romans were, in fact, very tolerant of other religions. They adopted local gods when they went into other countries, and they invited others to adopt their gods, but did not force them to. Contrary, also, to popular belief, the Romans did not persecute Christians BECAUSE they were Christians, but because they were trouble-makers and disturbers of the peace. Note that if Jesus was real (a big if!) and if the Romans did kill him, the method they used was the one they reserved for POLITICAL executions. Religious zealots and other such got tossed into the arena. Whoever Alexamenos was, there's nothing I can see in that posted image that "proves" he was a practicing CHRISTIAN. Maybe the graffiti "artist" was the Christian, and was mocking other religions for their habit of folding together pieces of humans and animals.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Anthony J Lombardi
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 9410
|
| Posted: 15 September 2013 at 12:55pm | IP Logged | 9
|
|
|
32 “Whoever acknowledges me before others, I will also acknowledge before my Father in heaven. 33 But whoever disowns me before others, I will disown before my Father in heaven. ~~~~~~~~ I like to cover all my bases. Growing a catholic school kid I learned that lesson young. Whenever I mention mythological deities. He who shall not be named gets mentioned first. Followed by the All-Father, Zeus last but not least is RA.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133318
|
| Posted: 15 September 2013 at 1:00pm | IP Logged | 10
|
|
|
Human history is full of lots and lots of gods, and present day religions have many too. The Hindus have hundreds.Which is why Richard Dawkins points out to Christians that they are, themselves, almost atheists. Hundreds, thousands of gods they don't believe in. We atheists just happen to go one further.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Darren Taylor
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 April 2004
Location: Scotland
Posts: 6024
|
| Posted: 15 September 2013 at 1:58pm | IP Logged | 11
|
|
|
There can be a lot of posts that have nothing to do with John Byrne, on a Forum about John Byrne. If John starts a new thread about something that isn't comics related, it still falls under the Forums headed catagory of John Byrne, so that's cool.
There are some threads that are posted that John hasn't started that are pretty good reads and that John contributes too, which sort of validates them under the JB topic!
But mostly I do this thing where I read -some- of a new thread, where the title has intreagued me and if I don't like it, I wont contribute to or read any more it. Freedom of choice.
I personally enjoy the fact that, here, people can interact with John in an environment that has clear and steadfast house rules.
-D
edit---interact for interect
Edited by Darren Taylor on 15 September 2013 at 2:00pm
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Steve De Young
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 April 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 3507
|
| Posted: 15 September 2013 at 3:23pm | IP Logged | 12
|
|
|
Not sure how that image "proves" anything, especially anything related to Christianity.
-------------------------
I was being brief because its a tangent here and all, but there's plenty of coordinate evidence. St. Irenaeus, for example, writing around 170 A.D., in arguing that there are four canonical gospels cites the fact that the cross of Christ had four points. Which works with an 'X' or a lower case 't' or a '+', but not with a stake or a 'T'. And you find crosses of all three of those shapes throughout Christian history. Based on all coordinate evidence, most scholars accept that the graffiti I posted is a representation of Christianity. At any rate, I was just addressing the 'torture stake' issue, which is etymologically true, but not historically accurate.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
|
|
Topic Closed)
