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James Elliott Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 November 2010 Location: United States Posts: 481
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Posted: 07 June 2013 at 5:20pm | IP Logged | 1
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After hearing about this, I'm glad I dropped FF a while back.
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Brian Hague Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 14 November 2006 Posts: 8515
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Posted: 07 June 2013 at 5:26pm | IP Logged | 2
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The notion that DC is straightjacketing its creators by micromanaging and blocking storylines that the creators feel passionately about is thrown into sharp relief by this storyline from MarvelNow. In his interview with BleedingCool.com, Paul Jenkins, the writer who wrote an open letter decrying the suffering he endured while writing Batman: Dark Knight for DC, mentions that the editor for the Flash asked him what direction he might take the book if he were the writer. Jenkins told him he'd blow off one of the Flash's legs with a roadside bomb and see how the character dealt with that. The editor walked away. This was an example offered by Jenkins of the kind of great ideas the creators are coming up with that we, the fans, will never know about because of DC's hidebound, corporate micromanagement. It sounds to me as if MarvelNow and the Fantastic Four could really use a good dose of hidebound, corporate micromanagement at this point.
Edited by Brian Hague on 07 June 2013 at 5:29pm
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Carmen Bernardo Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 August 2006 Location: United States Posts: 3666
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Posted: 07 June 2013 at 6:22pm | IP Logged | 3
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All of this kind of makes me glad that I stopped reading Marvel comics regularly back in the mid-1990s, and have stopped all together since 2004, when a book I was "cherry-picking" got warped out of recognition by a new creative team being brought on board.
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Mark Rand Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 29 May 2007 Location: United States Posts: 360
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Posted: 07 June 2013 at 6:29pm | IP Logged | 4
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Jenkins told him he'd blow off one of the Flash's legs with a roadside bomb and see how the character dealt with that. ******
I thought(OK hoped)Jenkins must be joking about maiming the Flash, so I checked out that interview. He wasn't. Whatever point he was trying to make about editorial annoyances wasn't helped by mentioning that. Sounds like a loose cannon writer who needs an editor like most people need oxygen. He also said this:
"Frankly, why on Earth would Disney have a care about a small industry like comics when their core product is the film and merchandising? They would naturally be most concerned with character maintenance."
Hard to see how that corporate concern for character maintenance is manifesting itself. But maybe I should be giving Disney more credit. If literally chopping off the limbs of the main character is the modern writer's idea of a "great" story, perhaps their worst instincts really are being restrained.
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Greg McPhee Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 August 2004 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 5091
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Posted: 07 June 2013 at 6:58pm | IP Logged | 5
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After hearing about this, I'm glad I dropped FF a while back.=================================================
I dropped the FF 6 issues in to Tom DeFalco's run, and never went back. Like my previous statement regarding Claremont and The X-Men, I'm glad I did now.
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Jason Mark Hickok Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 February 2009 Location: United States Posts: 10472
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Posted: 07 June 2013 at 7:10pm | IP Logged | 6
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I dropped the book after Hickman was moved. Glad I did!
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Shawn Kane Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 04 November 2010 Location: United States Posts: 3239
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Posted: 08 June 2013 at 6:11am | IP Logged | 7
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If literally chopping off the limbs of the main character is the modern writer's idea of a "great" story, perhaps their worst instincts really are being restrained. Marvel seems to be interested in writers who come from creator-owned comics right now. Their architects are guys who have made their name at Image and Vertigo. People like Bendis, Matt Fraction, Jonathan Hickman, Rick Remender, Jason Aaron, Keiron Gillen, Cullen Bunn, Sam Humphries, and others seem to be recruited by Marvel editorial because of those "independent" voices. What we get is stories that involve time Cyclops being a terrorist (or "freedom fighter" whatever), Charles Xavier being dead, Doctor Octopus being Spider-Man, and Tony Stark being Robert Downey Jr. Marvel editorial lauds these storylines and writers but you're not sure if the best interest of the characters is in place. I still read some Marvel comics but there are others that I think are broken so bad that I'll never pick up another issue.
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Craig Robinson Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 November 2010 Location: United States Posts: 1756
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Posted: 08 June 2013 at 7:27am | IP Logged | 8
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I feel your pain, Shawn. I collected Avengers, New Avengers, Captain America and Iron Man all before Marvel NOW and haven't touched a single issue of those titles since their stealth reboot. In full disclosure, I do enjoy Captain Marvel, Hawkeye and Daredevil.
Edited by Craig Robinson on 08 June 2013 at 7:28am
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Shawn Kane Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 04 November 2010 Location: United States Posts: 3239
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Posted: 08 June 2013 at 7:58am | IP Logged | 9
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For me, the X-Men has been broken more of less since Grant Morrison (Cyclops as cheating on Jean, killing off Jean, the overall Vertigo feel of the run) but there were signs of interest (I liked Astonishing at the beginning and Chris Claremont's return). It really went downhill when Ed Brubaker was allowed to insert a team of X-Men prior to the Giant-Size #1 team which led to what we have today. Some of these writers come in and aren't content with telling good stories, they follow their worst insticts and "fix" what they don't like about the characters. It's like having someone take your favorite action figure and break his arm off because he looks cooler that way.
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Michael Ferrier Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 May 2004 Posts: 83
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Posted: 08 June 2013 at 8:27am | IP Logged | 10
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Jenkins is currently writing Deathmatch for Boom! Studios. This superhero gladatorial contest -- with original characters of Jenkins's design, thankfully -- is being echoed at Marvel with stuff like Avengers Arena -- which I have not read, or glanced at, so I can't compare.
While superheroes have been pitted against each other via misunderstanding in team-ups and events like Contest of Champions, those earlier ones were ultimately non-lethal, and in keeping with the traditional spirit of comics, ending in mutual respect, or in team-ups, joining forces to defeat the real villain.
Deathmatch does what it says on the box. Sadly.
The most recent issue had a nonpowered Rorschach clone garotting another hero to death -- who by all accounts was something of a Superman type -- with a strand of barbed wire.
After reading that Flash comment, I can't help but imagine this title as Jenkins's own personal ant hill and he's standing there with a magnifying glass.
Fun. (Sarcasm.)
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 133324
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Posted: 08 June 2013 at 8:33am | IP Logged | 11
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I assume it would be whoever's currently in the Flash suit out for a stroll who'd get his leg blown off. The Flash, moving at anything like his normal speed, would be well past the danger zone before the roadside bomb fully triggered.
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Shawn Kane Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 04 November 2010 Location: United States Posts: 3239
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Posted: 08 June 2013 at 9:03am | IP Logged | 12
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I've read some postings and Jenkins made a comparison between what he has said he would like to write as opposed to the character duking it out with a giant killer robot that's attacking the earth. He added "as cool as that would look" that's not what he would like to write. Does he realize that comics are a visual medium and that people would rather see something cool than read about the Flash's issues as an amputee?
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