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Greg McPhee
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 August 2004
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 5091
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| Posted: 20 April 2013 at 3:57am | IP Logged | 1
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Stephen, do you think there was any doubt over the Curt Swan result on that poll?
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Matt Hawes
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 16502
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| Posted: 20 April 2013 at 8:27am | IP Logged | 2
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The problem with most people that are polled for a "Top" list of comic book stories on a character like Superman is that more than likely the majority has never read most of Superman's output over the character's entire history.
What I would like to see done with Superman (and Batman, and other characters that have been around for many decades) is for some publication, or news site, to find a sizable panel of true fans of the character who have read every issue, or nearly every issue of the run and have them vote on the best stories.
Yes, for a character that has been around 75 years, this might seem a tall order, but I am sure that there are enough fans out there who have been able to read most of the stories to make this possible. After all, The majority of "Superman" comics have been reprinted through the years, and a serious collector probably has a collection going back to the 1960's, at least.
Most of the people who vote for the polls we see are fans who mostly read the title during specific periods in the character's history. They aren't truly qualified to say what is the "best" stories in a 75-year-run.
Another way to do a poll on Superman's comic history would be to specifically choose different periods for the voting, such as "best 1970s' stories, best 1980s' stories," and so on. That way only the people that are familiar with the period in question would be likely to vote.
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Stephen Churay
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 March 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 8369
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| Posted: 20 April 2013 at 11:40pm | IP Logged | 3
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Stephen, do you think there was any doubt over the Curt Swan result on that poll?
=====
Sadly, yes. Recently, they did a March madness style polling tournament using particular runs from team books. I lost interest when JB's FF run lost out to the Ellis/Hitch run on THE AUTHORITY.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133326
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| Posted: 21 April 2013 at 4:58am | IP Logged | 4
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The businessman Luthor was a creation that saw more TV and movie appearances than any other version…•• The tycoon version of Luthor was Marv Wolfman's idea. My contribution was to develop his "seed" into what you saw in the comics.
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Tim O Neill
Byrne Robotics Security
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 10937
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| Posted: 21 April 2013 at 10:02am | IP Logged | 5
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I was really glad to see JB's run on Superman mentioned so frequently throughout the media coverage of the anniversary. The hardcore fanatics who suck the fun out of comic books will have you believe JB took a blowtorch to Superman, but his run made the character very engaging, interesting, and fun. And in light of what has come since, JB's take is about as controversial as a puppy. For someone like me who was not a fan of DC, I find JB's take as a gateway to the DC universe.
As far as reader polls, I don't put much if any credence in them. You don't know who is voting, and people cheat and vote multiple times, so it's a waste of time to even read them. I'm much more interested in what the writers/artists of the comic books consider their favorite stories.
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Eric Kleefeld
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 December 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4422
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| Posted: 21 April 2013 at 10:24am | IP Logged | 6
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Jovi Neri:
QUOTE:
| The businessman Luthor was a creation that saw more TV and movie appearances than any other version… |
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John Byrne:
QUOTE:
| The tycoon version of Luthor was Marv Wolfman's idea. My contribution was to develop his "seed" into what you saw in the comics. |
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Didn't Wolfman also want to have Luthor married to Lois and living in seclusion?
When I was reading The Fountainhead last year, at a certain point it hit me: Marv Wolfman's initial Luthor concept was taken from the character of Gail Wynand!
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Stephen Churay
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 March 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 8369
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| Posted: 21 April 2013 at 11:35am | IP Logged | 7
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The hardcore fanatics who suck the fun out of comic books will have
you believe JB took a blowtorch to Superman, but his run made the
character very engaging, interesting, and fun. And in light of what has
come since, JB's take is about as controversial as a puppy.
======
There's a guy who I run into at my LCS who thinks JB is the Antichrist
due to that Superman run. I ran into him about six months ago, after
the New52 had been out for about a year. I held up the latest issue
and said, "John Byrne's Superman is looking pretty good about now
isn't it?" he just hung is head in shame and saddness.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
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| Posted: 21 April 2013 at 11:42am | IP Logged | 8
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Didn't Wolfman also want to have Luthor married to Lois and living in seclusion?•• Wolfman's pitch was this: "Outside Metropolis is a mountain. On top of that mountain, in a fabulous Xanadu-like estate, lives Lex Luthor, the richest man on Earth, and his mistress, Lois Lane."
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Matt Hawes
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 16502
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| Posted: 21 April 2013 at 11:57am | IP Logged | 9
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"Mistress Lois Lane"?? ICK!
And I thought the Norman Osborn/Gwen Stacy romance was a horrid idea!!
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
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| Posted: 21 April 2013 at 12:01pm | IP Logged | 10
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The hardcore fanatics who suck the fun out of comic books will have you believe JB took a blowtorch to Superman, but his run made the character very engaging, interesting, and fun. And in light of what has come since, JB's take is about as controversial as a puppy.====== There's a guy who I run into at my LCS who thinks JB is the Antichrist due to that Superman run. I ran into him about six months ago, after the New52 had been out for about a year. I held up the latest issue and said, "John Byrne's Superman is looking pretty good about now isn't it?" he just hung is head in shame and saddness. •• It's important to remember that the assault on "my" Superman was unleashed before I had even put pencil to paper. The mere fact that DC announced I would be "rebooting" Superman was enough to set hardcore fans frothing at the mouth and, typical of such fans (unfortunately), once they had begun this crusade they could not back down, even after MAN OF STEEL started to appear, and the changes I made were seen to be mostly cosmetic.
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Robert White
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4560
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| Posted: 21 April 2013 at 2:12pm | IP Logged | 11
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JB's Superman does seem polarizing. Before the internet, I generally got the feeling that it was the first time in a long time that Superman had been readable and good. All I can say is that it was the right balance of concepts for a casual Superman fan who loved the first two Donner films, loved Superman toys and cartoons as a kid, but was really a Marvel reader.
For years I disliked all of the Silver Age stuff that was added on to Superman's mythos, but I'm starting to reassess this and now see the charm and imagination of much of it. This still doesn't mean that Man of Steel wasn't needed. Hardcore fans seem to forget, in retrospect, that Superman hadn't been relevant since the early 70's.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
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| Posted: 21 April 2013 at 5:39pm | IP Logged | 12
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JB's Superman does seem polarizing.•• Frustratingly, it wasn't really even "my" Superman that was polarizing. It was ME! I was, after all, viewed by many hard core Superman fans as a "Marvel Guy" who was invading the sacred halls of DC.
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