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Topic: Decompression: It’s not "mature" (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post ReplyPost New Topic
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Eric Kleefeld
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Posted: 23 March 2013 at 2:48pm | IP Logged | 1  

Bill Collins:

 QUOTE:
As for Alan Moore,i think his early work on 2000AD`s Future Shocks and his Warrior work being limited to 3-6 pages due to the weekly format in 2000AD and lack of budget for Warrior helped hone his skill at compression.

One interesting thing is that even after Warrior folded, and Moore brought back his Marvelman under the "Miracleman" title in the U.S., he continued to use basically the same format of 8-page chapters, each one of which genuinely advanced the story.

Many of the later issues are just 16 pages long, and an imaginary chapter line can be drawn at roughly the halfway point of each.  For the first issue of all-new content, Moore even continued the official chapter breaks.

When I first read those comics ages ago, I wasn't fully aware of the prior serialization and repackaging, nor was I familiar with the anthology magazine format of British comics.  In my mind, as I encountered chapter breaks within a single issue, I simply thought Moore was hearkening back to the old "multi-chapter" issues of Silver Age comics, which I had encountered in reprints of the Flash, the Hulk, and many others.

This makes me realize that the old "multi-chapter" structure would be a great thing to bring back, with or without the official chapter headings:  To take what is often done in two issues (or more) of many modern comics, and condense it down into the page-count of a single issue.

For example, The Incredible Hulk #1 was divided into five chapters: The first one begins with the bomb test, ends with Banner, now transformed into the Hulk, bursting through a wall and into the night. The second chapter is the Hulk's prowl, his fight with Army personnel, and confronting the spy Igor.  The third chapter has Banner and Rick evading the Army's questions about the night's events, and sorting out what is now happening to him.  The fourth chapter has Banner transform again, the Hulk going off and scaring Betty, and then he and Rick are confronted by the Gargoyle.  Finally, the fifth chapter (in the space of five pages!) has the Gargoyle fly Hulk and Rick all the way to Russia, the Gargoyle meeting Dr. Banner, with Banner curing the Gargoyle, and the Gargoyle sending Banner and Rick back before blowing up his bunker.

Nowadays, just try getting a comics writer to seriously advance their story in the space of eight pages.  It would take some people five issues to do what Lee and Kirby did in that same single Hulk comic!

Who needs a single cliffhanger at the end of an issue, when you can have multiple cliff-hangers in the course of just one comic?
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Bill Collins
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Posted: 23 March 2013 at 2:54pm | IP Logged | 2  

Eric,with 2000AD being weekly it was not too bad(Plus Future Shocks were self conrained stories),but with Warrior being monthly the wait for the next chapter was torture!
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Robbie Parry
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Posted: 23 March 2013 at 3:48pm | IP Logged | 3  

Nowadays, just try getting a comics writer to seriously advance their story in the space of eight pages.  It would take some people five issues to do what Lee and Kirby did in that same single Hulk comic!

***

Indeed. Issue one would be Bruce Banner and General Ross chatting about the gamma bomb, issues two and three would be the build-up, issue four would see Banner bathed in gamma rays and the fifth issue would finally see the Hulk!
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Greg McPhee
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Posted: 23 March 2013 at 5:18pm | IP Logged | 4  

In the extras on the DVD for Daredevil, Frank Miller talks about how a comics writer and artist have to be very smart to slow the flow and pace of the story down.

10 years later it seems they've cracked it.

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Eric Kleefeld
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Posted: 23 March 2013 at 7:45pm | IP Logged | 5  

Bill Collins:

 QUOTE:
Eric,with 2000AD being weekly it was not too bad(Plus Future Shocks were self contained stories),but with Warrior being monthly the wait for the next chapter was torture!

Well that might explain why Moore squeezed so much story (and action, too) into every eight pages!  And it's a good comment about him that he continued to maintain the same story/page ratio, even after the series switched over to being published in the American style.

But then, this leads to an obvious question: Why can't every comic be written that way, too?  When you keep yourself disciplined, and put as much story into every page as possible, you really do end up getting a better final product.
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Jovi Neri
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Posted: 23 March 2013 at 9:49pm | IP Logged | 6  

Not sure if I will ruffle feathers here, but I have not read a single Bendis story since I read more DC than Marvel.

When I think of decompression, I think of Jeph Loeb. I first read his Halloween specials which were single issues and loved them. I was blown away by The Long Halloween.

Then as more and more Jeph Loeb stories came out, they started to be the same, very dragging, and features repetitive such as the character narrating to himself/herself the entire time.

Sorry if I might offend some Jeph Loeb fans on this board. How come his name hasn't come out yet when it comes to decompression?
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Adam Jones
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Posted: 23 March 2013 at 9:53pm | IP Logged | 7  

I doubt you will ruffle feathers IMO most Internet fans who read a lot of Marvel titles are tired of Bendis's schtick. He moves comics with the general public though so he's here to stay for now.
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Thomas Fels
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Posted: 24 March 2013 at 12:20am | IP Logged | 8  

That's kind of the problem with decompressed storytelling. Exciting and different at first, when you discover it. But after a while, this new "exciting" form of storytelling is just that, a form, and is often used where it doesn´t fit.

About Loeb, he has done some fastpaced action too, somewhat more compressed, like Superman/Batman.

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Robert White
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Posted: 24 March 2013 at 1:00am | IP Logged | 9  

The indie writers that came in during the Quesada/Jemas years tend to appeal mainly to their fanbase and to fans that don't really care all that much about the characters and thus aren't bothered by the bad characterization and pacing. I do find that their creator owned stuff is far superior. 

I think it was a mistake to assume indie writers = better stories. The idea being that these guys were more "sophisticated" and better than the old warhorses that had been writing superheroes to that point. In some cases this is true, but in several cases some of those warhorses simply write better superhero stories since they understand the genre and get the characters.  
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Adam Jones
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Posted: 24 March 2013 at 1:45am | IP Logged | 10  

I will say Kurt Busiek's Avengers run was far more enjoyable for me than any story arc from any of the various Avengers titles Bendis put out when he was doing the story plotting for that department of Marvel.
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Bill Collins
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Posted: 24 March 2013 at 1:52am | IP Logged | 11  

The discipline to write concise stories needs to be editorially imposed,in today`s climate,that`s just not going to happen.Maybe when enough of us stop buying the bloated,crossover heavy comics,they will see the error of their ways.
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John Byrne
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Posted: 24 March 2013 at 5:24am | IP Logged | 12  

The discipline to write concise stories needs to be editorially imposed,in today`s climate,that`s just not going to happen.Maybe when enough of us stop buying the bloated,crossover heavy comics,they will see the error of their ways.

••

"Seeing the error of their ways" is not something the Powers That Be have been very good at for several decades now. Look at the last thirty years of American comics, and see how many times the attitude seems to be "Well, this didn't work last time, but now we're going to do it RIGHT!!"

I still recall with chill the heads of both Marvel and DC telling me the ideal situation would be "if we could just get the speculators back!"

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