| Author |
|
Shawn Kane
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 04 November 2010
Location: United States
Posts: 3239
|
| Posted: 16 September 2012 at 7:26am | IP Logged | 1
|
|
|
Alot of the Marvel heroes today aren't really heroic. Read an interview with an editor and they talk about how we don't live in a black and white world and comics should reflect that. I'm not a believer in that philosophy, I feel that a fantasy world shouldn't necessarily reflect the world we live in. I believe it comes from a group of writers who have a fascination with characters like Punisher, Venom, Deadpool, and others who started out as villains and became popular. It's not just comics, I'll ask my students who their favorite Star Wars character is and they'll tell me Darth Maul or the Imperial Droids. Popular culture has made the bad guys seem more interesting than the good guys. In TV sitcoms, the parents are usually the dumbest or at least the most dysfunctional members in the house. It seems that writers across the board don't want to be uncool and being just heroic in a comic book or being a character that always tries to do the right thing on a TV show isn't hip.
Edited by Shawn Kane on 16 September 2012 at 7:31am
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Anthony Sbarro
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 15 July 2012
Location: Canada
Posts: 45
|
| Posted: 16 September 2012 at 9:16am | IP Logged | 2
|
|
|
Brett Wilson wrote:
| Morrison come in and turn Magneto into a drug addict, who was cremating people alive |
|
|
I know I'm going to regret this, but can someone explain or post a link to an article describing this... 'storyline' in depth?
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Craig Robinson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 November 2010
Location: United States
Posts: 1756
|
| Posted: 16 September 2012 at 9:24am | IP Logged | 3
|
|
|
http://www.magnetowasright.com/pages/misc/faq.php Click the "what about Xorn?" link. It's a quick read. CBR has some panels and the quickie undo Marvel did after Morrison left. http://goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/2011/12/17/the-aban doned-an-forsaked-xorn-is-really-magneto/
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Anthony Sbarro
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 15 July 2012
Location: Canada
Posts: 45
|
| Posted: 16 September 2012 at 9:31am | IP Logged | 4
|
|
|
Thanks, Craig. :-) And yes, I was right: I did regret it. :-\
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Craig Robinson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 November 2010
Location: United States
Posts: 1756
|
| Posted: 16 September 2012 at 9:36am | IP Logged | 5
|
|
|
You're welcome. Be grateful; I learned the hard way.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
David Miller
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Posts: 3091
|
| Posted: 16 September 2012 at 10:07am | IP Logged | 6
|
|
|
It's funny to see Magneto wearing a sweat shirt. He didn't have any blinding white linen suits available?
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
Adam Hutchinson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 15 December 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 4502
|
| Posted: 16 September 2012 at 10:24am | IP Logged | 7
|
|
|
QUOTE:
Read an interview with an editor and they talk about how we
don't live in a black and white world and comics should reflect that.
|
|
|
See, I really don't mind the comic book universe having shades of gray.
Nor do I have much of a problem with morally gray protagonists. I just
think that what makes a hero, a hero is that they find a way to do what's
right IN SPITE of living in a morally gray world. That's the second half
of the equation that many modern comic book writers have forgotten or
ignore.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Robert White
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4560
|
| Posted: 16 September 2012 at 10:46am | IP Logged | 8
|
|
|
I agree that superheroes are most interesting when living in a world that's not black & white. That was the whole point of The Marvel Age of Comics and why it was such a good thing for the industry and the genre. But the heroes themselves should be black & white, flaws and all. The heroes (true ones, not anti-heroes like Punisher who are needed, too) should aspire to ideals above what the rank and file of humanity settle for. That's the point of idealism and the point of heroes in general. Seems simple to me. I want to read about individuals better than me so that maybe, just maybe, some of that will rub off in the end.
Of course nobody is saying that EVERY comic should be written like this, only the superhero genre itself. The problem I see is given the fact that this is the only really viable mainstream genre anymore, that the creators and editors bring in a lot of diametrically opposed stuff to compensate.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133279
|
| Posted: 16 September 2012 at 11:34am | IP Logged | 9
|
|
|
Read an interview with an editor and they talk about how we don't live in a black and white world and comics should reflect that. ++ See, I really don't mind the comic book universe having shades of gray. Nor do I have much of a problem with morally gray protagonists. I just think that what makes a hero, a hero is that they find a way to do what's right IN SPITE of living in a morally gray world. That's the second half of the equation that many modern comic book writers have forgotten or ignore. •• As I have mentioned before, Roger Stern used to say of one writer of our generation that he could not write superheroes because he did not believe anyone could be more noble than he was. Unfortunately, that was not very, and doubly unfortunately, that did not stop him writing superheroes. The current crop of fan-bred, ennui engorged writers are much the same. They don't believe in heroes. Show them a hero, and they look for an ulterior motive. They look for "shades of gray", which to them means something "dark". Stan Lee wrote characters with "shades of gray", and we got the Thing, and the Hulk, and the Sub-Mariner. We got Galactus, who devoured worlds and killed billions of intelligent beings -- and was not evil! Let's see a modern writer come up with something as intellectually challenging as THAT, and THEN they can talk about their "shades of gray".
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Shawn Kane
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 04 November 2010
Location: United States
Posts: 3239
|
| Posted: 16 September 2012 at 4:49pm | IP Logged | 10
|
|
|
I just think that what makes a hero, a hero is that they find a way to do what's right IN SPITE of living in a morally gray world. EXACTLY. I was never a huge Wolverine fan but he was a character that, to me, fought the urge to be a killer by being heroic. That made him cool to me. Today's writers (and, in turn, their fans) think that his body count is what makes him cool.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Steven Myers
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 10 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5678
|
| Posted: 16 September 2012 at 5:07pm | IP Logged | 11
|
|
|
As for Wolverine, I liked what Len Wein said, that Wolverine's at his best when he gets just up to the point where he's about to go crazy and kill everyone...then stops himself. I think Claremont gave up when Wolverine got his own series. The first issue was a big bloodbath, which seemed to be capitulating to the what the audience wanted. Who was it that said you should never give the audience what they think they want????
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
Larry Morris
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 15 July 2007
Location: United States
Posts: 622
|
| Posted: 16 September 2012 at 5:51pm | IP Logged | 12
|
|
|
QUOTE:
| I agree that superheroes are most interesting when living in a world that's not black & white. That was the whole point of The Marvel Age of Comics and why it was such a good thing for the industry and the genre. But the heroes themselves should be black & white, flaws and all. The heroes (true ones, not anti-heroes like Punisher who are needed, too) should aspire to ideals above what the rank and file of humanity settle for. That's the point of idealism and the point of heroes in general. Seems simple to me. I want to read about individuals better than me so that maybe, just maybe, some of that will rub off in the end. |
|
|
This. No, the world isn't black and white, but when was it? Watergate is in the early 70s? Corruption at the top. The world didn't become grey in the last 15-20 years. Darker, ends justify the means heroes, or protagonists, aren't new. DIRTY HARRY started in the early 70s. DEATH WISH the same.
The world can be murky, the true hero rises above it. Have greyer characters if you must. I'm okay with that. John Walker can engage in that as long as Steve Rogers is pure. Problem is that now they think the Steve Rogers should be really flawed as well now.That Cyclops, of all X Men, should sanction kill squads because now he's a real leader making tough decisions in a really harsh world.
Thing is, the Quesadas, Bendis and Millars think they are being true to what "Stan and Jack did". They said it multiple times and it's such bullshit. That is not how they flawed their characters. Bad enough they are doing what they do, they have to pin it on Lee and Kirby?
Someone asked about Magneto and drugs. He was hooked on a drug, called kick, that some mutants took. It turned out to be an ageless sentient bacteria. It's a LONG story.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Topic Closed)
