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Daniel Gillotte
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 11 October 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 2662
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| Posted: 27 July 2012 at 4:07pm | IP Logged | 1
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If Casaday's version is the one on the far right, it IS an improvement over the first 3 horrid ones. They probably just should have had him draw it from the start.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133338
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| Posted: 27 July 2012 at 4:20pm | IP Logged | 2
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When did simple and clean lose out to complicated and cluttered. More does not equal better."If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit." - W.C. Fields •• I've noted before that this seems to be seepage from the toy business, where "perceived value" is a bi-word, and leads to all kinds of extra STUFF coming along for the ride. Remember Spider-Man's shield in the SECRET WARS toys? In comics, I have long referred to this as "tonnage". It's as if the customer is buying comics by the weight, so lots and lots and lots of lines on the page equals QUALITY. Like how the writers who use lots and lots of words are the BETTER writers. Magpies are very easy to fool.
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Carmen Bernardo
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 August 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 3666
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| Posted: 27 July 2012 at 6:00pm | IP Logged | 3
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Going over that Brian Hibbs Tilting At Windmills article on CBR that Stephen pointed out, I can't help but feel like I'm getting word of a close relative dying, and can only view from a distance how awful it has become... There was a time when becoming a Marvel Comics artist or writer was one of my childhood dreams. The more I see what is happening there, the more bittersweet I feel. It would've been nice to actually contribute something to the company that inspired me so much, but I don't think I'd have stayed with them after Bill Jemas and Joe Quesada got their hands on it.
Edited by Carmen Bernardo on 27 July 2012 at 6:02pm
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Craig Ashforth
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 April 2005
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 466
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| Posted: 27 July 2012 at 7:24pm | IP Logged | 4
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the artists nowadays have more than enough trouble hitting deadlines without making it even harder on themselves with such stupid excessive unnecessary costume gubbins
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Mike Norris
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4274
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| Posted: 27 July 2012 at 8:39pm | IP Logged | 5
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Maybe its because I grew up seeing them, but a Cap mask where the wings don't stick out just looks wrong.
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Matt Wieringo
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 29 April 2010
Location: United States
Posts: 164
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| Posted: 27 July 2012 at 8:53pm | IP Logged | 6
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There's a lot of good stuff in comics these days. I like a lot of the art and some of the writing. (Wonder Woman and Daredevil, in particular.) But I have to say Petter is right. The Big Two could learn a lot about branding from some other companies. Hire an ad agency. The constant reboots, re-numberings and costume/identity changes have dreadfully muddied their brands. There's such rampant inconsistency in the titles I've all but given up. I can't imagine it's much fun trying to write stories in that environment.
Remember those old FUN 'N' GAMES books Marvel put out way back when? One of the "puzzles" was a page full of character silhouettes and the reader had to guess the character based on that. I'd have trouble doing that with a lot of the current stable.
I LOVE comics. And I LOVE Marvel and DC characters. I've stopped buying a lot of their comics these days but I'd love to come back. I just wish they'd make it easy.
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Glenn Brown
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 3095
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| Posted: 27 July 2012 at 8:54pm | IP Logged | 7
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From the perspective of a long-time Cap fan, the design is an epic fail. Remove that emotion from the equation and from a design POV, I find it overdesigned and impractical...a case of the tail wagging the dog. I'm not just saying this because it is the John Byrne Forum but give me the Cap of John's vintage on that title (#247-255) any day of the week over this Ultimatization. I like Opena's work but this seems to me to be less about a re-design and more of an edict from marketing/editorial to make the suit look more like an amalgam of Cap's two film costumes.
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Mark Haslett
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6431
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| Posted: 27 July 2012 at 9:24pm | IP Logged | 8
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"Please. Don't make me wear that."
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Bill Guerra
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 29 March 2012
Location: United States
Posts: 1072
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| Posted: 27 July 2012 at 9:52pm | IP Logged | 9
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I said it before and I'll say it again: I knew the whole Ultimate Comics nonsense was a bad idea from the start. Every character in the normal Marvel Universe looks just like their Ultimate counterpart now.
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Ronald Joseph
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 18 April 2011
Location: United States
Posts: 1784
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| Posted: 27 July 2012 at 10:16pm | IP Logged | 10
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I said it before and I'll say it again: I knew the whole Ultimate Comics nonsense was a bad idea from the start. Every character in the normal Marvel Universe looks just like their Ultimate counterpart now.
It's a vicious cycle: make a separate, "ultimate" universe for new, young readers, base the movies primarily on the "ultimate" line, then revamp the "mainstream" characters so that they resemble the movies.
Edited by Ronald Joseph on 27 July 2012 at 10:16pm
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Michael Todd
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 07 September 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 4115
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| Posted: 27 July 2012 at 10:30pm | IP Logged | 11
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I bought the runs of Marvel Masterworks for Captain America, Iron Man, Thor, X-Men, Fantastic Four, Avengers, Daredevil, Sub-Mariner, Spider-Man, Marvel Team-Up, Inhumans, Hulk, Defenders and Doctor Strange and have been reading them, it's like having the real Marvel Comics Group back again. What is being published now isn't "my" Marvel.
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Stephen Churay
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 March 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 8369
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| Posted: 27 July 2012 at 10:54pm | IP Logged | 12
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Michael, sadly it's not mine either. Marvel had it's ups and downs over
the years, but once Avengers Disassembled started, it marked the
being of the end for me. Since then, I have continued to go back to
the well looking for my thirst to be quenched only to find sand. Then I
would only pick up titles or runs to support a favorite artist here and
there. Well, anything that was left of my Marvel has completely
vanished with the NOW relaunch. Maybe somebody out there is
looking forward to this, but it's not for me. I'll still enjoy JB's books,
Rocketeer, and up coming Judge Dredd from IDW as well as a few
western and pulp titles from Dynamite. Other than that, I'm done!
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Topic Closed)
