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William T. Byrd Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 04 August 2009 Posts: 209
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Posted: 23 April 2012 at 10:44am | IP Logged | 1
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I'm a little surprised to hear that older fans in the 70's were considered freaks by those in the biz, when Stan Lee had written in letter columns back in the late 60's about how college students and older were Marvel readers... I believe I've seen some old youtube clips of Stan saying the same thing on camera. Of course that could've just been what he said to make sure that day's kid audience would keep buying as they got older.
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Petter Myhr Ness Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 02 July 2009 Location: Norway Posts: 3908
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Posted: 23 April 2012 at 11:16am | IP Logged | 2
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...only to be told that Batman was considered on of the ADULT characters. --
It's a paradox that I've been reading Batman less and less as I've gotten older. No wonder, as the O'Neill/Adams or Conway/Colan stories were made before he became and adult character. (Though I'm sure there are those who will claim that those stories were never meant for "just the kids".)
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Shawn Kane Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 04 November 2010 Location: United States Posts: 3239
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Posted: 23 April 2012 at 11:20am | IP Logged | 3
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It goes down the same road as creators who want their comics to take place in the "real world". They have to satisfy themselves and the adult fanbase. What kid could sit down and read one issue of Bendis' Daredevil (lauded by many adult readers) and come away feeling excited by it?
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Stephen Churay Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 March 2009 Location: United States Posts: 8369
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Posted: 23 April 2012 at 1:11pm | IP Logged | 4
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My example has always been the Brubaker Captain America. (previous series). As a 38 yr. old, I thought it was great, but I couldn't let my 9 yr. old read it. It just wasn't appropriate. Well, that's wrong. How do you tell a 9 yr. old that he can't read the latest issue of Captain America.
So far, the new series seems to be a bit better at that, but it's still early.
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Carmen Bernardo Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 August 2006 Location: United States Posts: 3666
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Posted: 23 April 2012 at 4:58pm | IP Logged | 5
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I think John raised a good point about the trend in comics that finally drove me out of them. I was that kid who got hooked on his work on the X-Men and continued to follow him over to the Fantastic Four. Later, as I matured, I started looking for other comics and found myself getting into the imported and translated Japanese stuff when Marvel's superheroes started losing their appeal to me. As a result, when I came back to Marvel on two occasions and saw what the new generation was doing there, it sank in that I wasn't going to be able to stay with them. Today, I think far too many of the current crop of editors and creative staff have taken the advice of Len Wein and Stan Lee, and just tossed them into the wastebasket...
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Shaun Barry Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 December 2008 Location: United States Posts: 6905
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Posted: 23 April 2012 at 5:51pm | IP Logged | 6
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Too many comic book writers, from the looks and sounds of things these days, seem to only want to write for 3 groups: Media outlets, literary critics and Hollywood executives. But writing for kids? Well, that's for babies! My daughters have a growing love for superheroes, but it's downright depressing when they ask me to buy a Batgirl or Supergirl comic that they see sometimes at Toys R Us, only to have me tell them, "No, too violent, too dark, not for little girls." I'll order them some back issues online from time-to-time, but said issues tend to be (or have to be!) at least 25 or 30 years old!
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Stephen Churay Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 25 March 2009 Location: United States Posts: 8369
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Posted: 23 April 2012 at 8:36pm | IP Logged | 7
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I find it interesting that the shift in age groups came the same time thought bubbles made way for captions. I guess adults find thought bubbles silly.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 133324
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Posted: 24 April 2012 at 3:50am | IP Logged | 8
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…thought bubbles…•• Thought balloons.
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James Woodcock Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 September 2007 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 7787
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Posted: 24 April 2012 at 3:55am | IP Logged | 9
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I've got boxes and boxes of comics from my childhood (collected post dad-purge). These are the comics my son will be bought up on - the B&W UK Marvel comics, the Essential volumes I've been buying and the America comics up to the mid '80's. The late '80s, '90s onward will be what he gets when he is a teenager. The current stuff? I'm not sure when. If he reads a few comics a day he will have more than enough to keep him going through his entire childhood. I see no reason to give him the modern comics. I recognise that this means that I may well contribute to the death of the industry and there may be no new comics by the time he reaches 20. I also recognise that this may well have an impact on the type of relationship he will have with comics - read the old stuff, but never buying one for himself. I desperatly want to find a way to square that circle. It may be buying the UK children's comics of Spider-Man but I'm unsure at the moment.
Edited by James Woodcock on 24 April 2012 at 3:58am
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 133324
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Posted: 24 April 2012 at 4:07am | IP Logged | 10
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My daughters have a growing love for superheroes, but it's downright depressing when they ask me to buy a Batgirl or Supergirl comic that they see sometimes at Toys R Us, only to have me tell them, "No, too violent, too dark, not for little girls."•• A key problem, right there, is that the current producers of the comics have forgotten (if they ever truly understood) that the female avatars of various characters were CREATED to appeal to (young) female readers. They were NOT created as "bad girls" for emotionally stunted males to whack off over.
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Robert White Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 4560
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Posted: 24 April 2012 at 5:50am | IP Logged | 11
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To me the industry has often taken it too far to the extreme. On one end of the spectrum we have the post-WWII "goofifying" of the DC characters (not that I don't find many of those comics fun) while on the other end we have the post-Watchman/DKR world of equally ridiculous "grime and gritty" heroes who still bound around in the same costumes.
Comics, for me, are at their best when they are truly "all-age" and not just for kids or just for adults. Technically, isn't "all-age" the perfect product?
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Bill Catellier Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 September 2007 Location: United States Posts: 3225
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Posted: 24 April 2012 at 6:21am | IP Logged | 12
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Shaun - having the same problem. My oldest is currently loving CAPTAIN CARROT books (the originals), but not many of those made. Looking around for something else.
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