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Joe Hollon Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 May 2004 Location: United States Posts: 13695
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Posted: 03 September 2011 at 8:48am | IP Logged | 1
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This is either the best or worst (depending on how you look at it) scene featuring a water-based hero in the history of comics:
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Joe Hollon Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 08 May 2004 Location: United States Posts: 13695
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Posted: 03 September 2011 at 8:51am | IP Logged | 2
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Reading the old Aquaman comics I really was annoyed by the whole "has to be immersed in water every hour" weakness. It was like, at 59 minutes he's fine but at 60 minutes....near death! Same thing with Martian Manhunter and his weakness to fire. The idea that fire can harm him like anyone else is fine but when someone lights a cigarette across the street and he passes out it's just silly.
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Daniel Gillotte Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 11 October 2005 Location: United States Posts: 2660
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Posted: 03 September 2011 at 9:45am | IP Logged | 3
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I'm an Aquaman and Namor fan. I equate it with loving swimming as a kid and wanting to be them! Story-wise, I can't suggest any specifically, though I love the way Jim Aparo drew Aquaman.
I like that they have super strength based on the difference of water pressure. I like that they have concerns beyond simply getting the bad guy.
And I love, "IMPERIUS REX!!!"
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Stephen Robinson Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 5835
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Posted: 03 September 2011 at 10:54am | IP Logged | 4
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What I liked about NAMOR was that I thought JB treated Namor's water-based background as just that -- background. It was as if he was writing Superman or Thor. With either of those characters, you don't think, "Every story has to be on Krypton or on Asgard."Even outside of water, Namor's powers are extensive -- and JB even removed his power of flight early into the run (can't remember why, though I'm sure it's in the FAQ somewhere).
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Chad Carter Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 June 2005 Posts: 9584
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Posted: 03 September 2011 at 2:56pm | IP Logged | 5
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I think water, like outer space, is a tough sell since we humans don't live in water and don't live in outer space. It's an alien environment that doesn't adhere to physical laws humans are generally familiar with. It's not hard to figure out why readers can't clue in to water adventures as much. What works is an undersea compound, or a floating compound like Hydrobase. In the undersea version, the threat for non-aquatic characters to die from hull breaches or the like lends itself to the story. The ocean itself is an antagonist. One way or another, the aquatic hero who needs water sustenance can go the Triton route, with the danger being that any severe damage to the sustaining device could mean a suffocating death for the hero. In general, I think readers can understand the dangers of the ocean more than the life-preserving ocean for a non-human. So when doing Aquaman, I think you keep him dealing with surface folks who are vulnerable to what he is not vulnerable to. In that, he becomes their Superman. Out of the water, Aquaman can need help both in acclimating to surface culture and the inherent vulnerabilities of an Atlantean/human.
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Chad Carter Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 June 2005 Posts: 9584
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Posted: 03 September 2011 at 2:58pm | IP Logged | 6
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I think for my money that Abe Sapien in the Hellboyverse is probably the most successful aquatic hero I can think of. I'm not even sure Abe needs water sustenance in the comics, though the movie version has a kind of scuba suit to walk around on the surface with. Abe rarely is seen beneath the waves, but when he does, his experience is usually mirrored by human anxiety. He's obviously an ocean dweller, but just as obviously he only has a limited view of the totality of the ocean. There are many, many things there Abe has never experienced, which connects the reader to him emotionally.
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Bill Catellier Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 September 2007 Location: United States Posts: 3225
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Posted: 03 September 2011 at 5:52pm | IP Logged | 7
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Of the two big names, I've always preferred Aquaman to Namor. As John mentioned above I think the success of either comes down to writing. They've both had successful series in the past so they certainly can again.
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Wallace Sellars Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 May 2004 Location: United States Posts: 17698
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Posted: 03 September 2011 at 6:20pm | IP Logged | 8
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One of the cool things about the Sub-Mariner is that he's a relatively "skinny" guy with no protective attire who has battled the FF to a standstill and taken on the incredible Hulk and triumphed!
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Daniel Gillotte Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 11 October 2005 Location: United States Posts: 2660
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Posted: 03 September 2011 at 7:05pm | IP Logged | 9
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"One of the cool things about the Sub-Mariner is that he's a relatively "skinny" guy with no protective attire who has battled the FF to a standstill and taken on the incredible Hulk and triumphed!"Yep, total badass!
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Ron Chevrier Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Location: Canada Posts: 1641
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Posted: 04 September 2011 at 12:18am | IP Logged | 10
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I think Aquaman is totally cool, and frequently dismissed as a lesser character, despite having roughly the same abilities as the Sub-Mariner. Okay, okay, he can't fly.
Bear in mind that along with the "Big 3", he and Green Arrow were the only continuously published superheroes well into the 50's and 60's. Many factors hurt Aquaman, however; not only was he a perennial backup strip, but he was never cover featured for his first 20 or so years of publication. Even GA made a few cover appearances. Furthermore, his adventures were pretty lightweight, focusing on thwarting corrupt sea captains and criminals of a similar sea-going ilk, or playing up the fantasy "talking to fish" elements. He never developed a nemesis or rogues gallery until decades later.
Most damaging to the character was his appearance as one of the Super Friends, clearly the first exposure that many people had to Aquaman. While the show clearly took liberties with every member's effectiveness and abilities, Aquaman generally came off as the ineffective dolt who sometimes summoned his finny friends. I think that this is the stigma he has carried with him ever since.
The Justice League cartoon at least made an attempt to make him a surly badass like he was in the comics of the 90's. Regardless of individual opinions of this characterization, at least he wasn't lame. I quite prefer the light-hearted, boisterous, fun-seeking version in the Brave and the Bold, cartoon, which though he has no resemblance to the comics is entertaining, and is probably the breakout character of the series (although I very much enjoyed their versions of Plastic Man and B'wana Beast) .
Edited by Ron Chevrier on 04 September 2011 at 12:20am
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Thom Price Byrne Robotics Member
LHomme Diabolique
Joined: 29 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 7593
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Posted: 04 September 2011 at 12:31am | IP Logged | 11
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I quite prefer the light-hearted, boisterous, fun-seeking version in the Brave and the Bold, cartoon, which though he has no resemblance to the comics is entertaining, and is probably the breakout character of the series
***
Quite the opposite reaction for me. I think it's a rather sad indication of how low Aquaman is regarded that writers feel they need to give him another character's personality. For years, DC has tried turning him into a poor man's Namor, and then Brave and the Bold grafted on the persona of Marvel's Hercules to the character. I found it no less awkward than if Wonder Woman behaved like She-Hulk.
Edited by Thom Price on 04 September 2011 at 12:31am
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Wallace Sellars Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 May 2004 Location: United States Posts: 17698
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Posted: 04 September 2011 at 7:10am | IP Logged | 12
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I found it no less awkward than if Wonder Woman behaved like She-Hulk. --- Agreed!
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