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Jason Larouse
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 10 May 2011
Posts: 515
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| Posted: 03 August 2011 at 7:42pm | IP Logged | 1
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How could Storm not be done in another race? She grew up in Africa and lived as a thief until she got her power. Contrary to popular belief, there are other races in Africa!
In fact, wasn't she born in New York?
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John Webster
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 August 2004
Posts: 155
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| Posted: 03 August 2011 at 7:54pm | IP Logged | 2
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Marvel, and specifically Tom Brevoort, are saying very loudly that those against the new Spider-Man (and Idris Elba as Heimdall shortly before) are closet racists.
http://www.formspring.me/TomBrevoort/q/223078754711279765
"I think the problem people have is that a black actor got cast in a role that's typically been portrayed as white, and their casual racism is coming out."
http://www.formspring.me/TomBrevoort/q/192633972121964759
http://www.formspring.me/TomBrevoort/q/223201395375905438
"It's difficult to speak in terms of absolute universalities, but for the most part, I think that people being upset about an actor of a different ethnicity being cast as a character are really expressing a problem with race, and just dressing it up as being a problem with character."
I feel a little more offended than usual when reading these kinds of things from Marvel and Brevoort, because they're not just telling me I'm wrong, but that I'm a bad person.
It's mind-reading of the worst sort. One cannot legitimately believe that these decisions are mistakes. It has to be veiled racism.
Edited by John Webster on 03 August 2011 at 7:55pm
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Pete York
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 1198
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| Posted: 03 August 2011 at 8:21pm | IP Logged | 3
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Paul Kimball
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 September 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 2216
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| Posted: 03 August 2011 at 9:53pm | IP Logged | 4
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Yeah, but that was part of a "Every alternate universe Superman possible"
sequence. Not the same thing. And heck, when they actually tried Black
Superman they made a new character who took on his own identity and is
one of the few 90s characters to have any sort of traction.
++++++
With this build-up, I thought you meant Icon from the Milestone Universe. A
interesting character and good series I thought. Don't know where he is now.
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Thom Price
Byrne Robotics Member
L’Homme Diabolique
Joined: 29 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 7593
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| Posted: 03 August 2011 at 10:33pm | IP Logged | 5
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Let's call it like it is. This is nothing more then another short term sales boosting publicity stunt. Marvel contacts the mainstream news media
***
This is all the comic book industry has left: acts of desperation. Kill a character. Revive a character. Change a costume. Alter a character's race or sexual orientation. Change continuity. Change continuity back. These are the only tricks left in the bag, and all in the hopes of grabbing a small degree of attention.
Taken it and of itself, I can hardly bring myself to care about this change to Spider-Man. It's temporary* alteration to a secondary version of the character. But as a symptom of the state of comic books, it's very sad indeed.
Comic books are dead to me. I'm so far removed from them, I no longer even mourn their loss. I satisfy my love for super heroes from other sources: the rare film or cartoon series or video game that gets it right.
I do feel bad for folks like JB, though, who have dedicated their lives and talents to the elevation of this art form, only to see everyone around them setting it on fire.
*If there's anyone around who thinks this will be a permanent change, I have a bridge I'd like to sell you.
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Matt Reed
Byrne Robotics Security
Robotmod
Joined: 16 April 2004
Posts: 36161
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| Posted: 03 August 2011 at 11:41pm | IP Logged | 6
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Brevoort's comments are divisive and sickening. He frames the
debate where the only possible resolution to opposition is that you're
racist. Absurd. He's a company mouthpiece, as he's clearly
established in many a thread on his own message board. Best to
ignore him as such and move on.
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JT Molloy
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 February 2008
Posts: 2092
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| Posted: 03 August 2011 at 11:58pm | IP Logged | 7
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What about all the black and hispanic people that don't like it? Closet-self-loathers??
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Craig Robinson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 28 November 2010
Location: United States
Posts: 1756
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| Posted: 04 August 2011 at 12:00am | IP Logged | 8
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So there I was picking up Rucka's new Punisher #1 and I saw this Ultimate Fallout book (polybagged, mind you). Why bag a book with intentionally spoiled contents is beyond me, but anyway. I wanted to see if the Glenn Beck Rage* was worthwhile, so I bought it.
Not exactly a stellar introduction and the near constant calling of attention to this situation being in bad taste did this character no favors. It's like awkwardly flirting with a woman and continually telling her how awkward the situation is. All I was left with was a character I know nothing about and an author-imposed message that this is all in bad taste. Not to mention that it's a vignette book with 2 other stories about characters and events I know and care nothing for.
I am not left with any desire to buy the two follow-up books to this story, and certainly not this character's launch title. I'd say much ado about nothing, but it doesn't warrant Shakespeare.
IGN had a great interview with a comic fan with some great wisdom: pointing out how not normal a non-white Spider-Man is does not make Marvel a champion of diversity (and many riffs on this theme have been made over the past few pages).
If they truly wanted to tell a story like this, they would put someone like Dr. Michael Eric Dyson on creative. On an original character.
To bookend from where I began this thread, I do not see this project leading to a TV or movie project for this new character. File this as forgettable.
*Ok, that link won't paste in a way that, you know, works like a link. Beck blames this new Spider-Man on the First Lady and other Progressive Boogey-People. Google for it if you want a Glenn Beck life-validation.
Edited by Craig Robinson on 04 August 2011 at 12:25am
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David Spurlock
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 281
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| Posted: 04 August 2011 at 12:19am | IP Logged | 9
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File this as forgettable.
------------------------------------------------------------ ----------------------
Of course it's forgettable. Virtually every "stunt" done in modern comics is forgettable. Nothing is done for the long term, it's all for the short dollar haul. It's a frantic ploy to try and lure in new buyers with the latest "BIG EVENT".
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133776
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| Posted: 04 August 2011 at 4:06am | IP Logged | 10
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ile this as forgettable. ++ Of course it's forgettable. Virtually every "stunt" done in modern comics is forgettable. Nothing is done for the long term, it's all for the short dollar haul. It's a frantic ploy to try and lure in new buyers with the latest "BIG EVENT". •• I find myself thinking once again of the death of Phoenix, an event which is still being talked about thirty years later. What made that different from virtually all that has followed? Simple, really. It was a STORY. Despite all the behind-the-scenes turmoil, it was a STORY that flowed organically from what had gone before. And, perhaps even more important, it wasn't PLANNED. It didn't happen because Chris and I sat down and said "What can we do to draw attention to this book? What can we do to sell some extra copies?" Instead, we built our STORY one day at a time, one issue at a time, over a span of a couple of years. Unfortunately, in many ways it was the death of Phoenix -- or, more correctly, the misperceptions of how it came to pass, and how "successful" it was -- that CREATED the "event mentality" in comics. Mea culpa.
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Kip Lewis
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 March 2011
Posts: 2880
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| Posted: 04 August 2011 at 5:27am | IP Logged | 11
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Picked up the issue; not a great introduction, but I have enjoyed
Bendis' Ultimate Spider-man since the beginning, so I will give Ult
Spider-man II a chance.
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Paulo Pereira
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 24 April 2006
Posts: 15539
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| Posted: 04 August 2011 at 5:37am | IP Logged | 12
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QUOTE:
| This is where I should feel offended, but, reading most of our forums, I think I have to agree...! |
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Whoops! I shouldn't have made such a blanket statement; should have phrased it differently. Sorry about that, Francesco.
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Topic Closed)
