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John W Leys
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 29 April 2004
Posts: 1143
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| Posted: 17 January 2005 at 5:40pm | IP Logged | 1
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Thom Price wrote:
My hopes for the film diminished once I saw that
the costume was essentially the same as in the previous films.
Putting Batman in armor is a mistake; it shifts the emphasis on the
gadgets and not the man. This is supposed to be Batman, not Iron
Man. |
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Couldn't agree more. Everything else I've seen or heard about Batman
Begins has gotten me very excited, but everytime I see the rubber
bat-suit I cringe...
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Roger A Ott II
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 29 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5371
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| Posted: 17 January 2005 at 9:59pm | IP Logged | 2
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John W Leys wrote:
| Couldn't agree more. Everything else I've seen or heard about Batman Begins has gotten me very excited, but everytime I see the rubber bat-suit I cringe... |
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I'll be okay with it only if he's able to turn his head without having to turn the rest of his torso with it...
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Doug Jones
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 2357
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| Posted: 17 January 2005 at 11:32pm | IP Logged | 3
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John Byrne wrote:
Last night, Terry Austin stopped by for dinner, and
since he does not have a computer, I showed him
the trailer for "Batman Begins" online. One major
problem he had, he said, was that this appears to
him to be "the Denny O'Neil" origin, with Bruce
trekking off to Tibet to learn from some sensei
master. Terry feels this diminishes what he calls the
"by his own bootstraps" element of the origin. He
likes that Bruce is self-taught, that he worked on his
own to become Batman.
This aspect does not trouble me, as there was never
any specific point made in the origin that said Bruce
had not sought out the best teachers in the
world, and, indeed, the Batman I grew up reading
had many such -- the origin of the batarang, for
instance, was his learning from an Austrailian
boomerang expert.
Thoughts? |
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Terry Austin doesn't have a computer? Wow.
I've no problem with the notion that Batman aquires many of his discliplines from skilled experts, and I actually think it's kind of cool. What I don't like, based on the photos, is the notion that parts of Batman's identity, like the gloves, are influenced by these same experts.
I do like the idea that we actually see the character from the beginning, though. I did not like Tim Burton's "seeing Bruce train to be Batman would be boring" approach.
Some additional hi-res pics from the film can be found here.
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Steve Lyons
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 02 September 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 2171
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| Posted: 18 January 2005 at 12:05am | IP Logged | 4
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That Christopher Walken shot looks like Christopher Lee, during his Hammer Dracula days.
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Doug Jones
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 2357
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| Posted: 18 January 2005 at 12:22am | IP Logged | 5
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Sam Karns wrote:
Could anyone break down what was wrong with the Batman films and discuss what was right with them?
You may include the serials as well thru Batman & Robin.
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Virtually nothing about Burton's Batman resembles the character in any significant way, and in fact, Batman's behavior in the films seems more representative of his villains than the character himself. Burton's Batman is borderline crazy, uncharacteristically inept (he's shot three times in the first film alone), and a combination of stupid and reckless (i.e., disposing of a lethal chemical factory--by blowing it into the air. And we thought the Joker was deadly!).
Some of this is due to Burton's weaknesses as a storyteller--particularly when it comes to action films--but I believe most of this is due to Burton's inherent dislike of the character, which is evident in both of his films.
Batman's production design is gorgeous, but from Batman Returns forward, the films get progressively more garish in every visual aspect--costuming, sets, makeup, and camera work.
The one redeemable element of Batman and Robin is George Clooney. He's claimed responsibility for killing the franchise but, I think he resembled Bruce Wayne far more than either Keaton or the somnambulant Kilmer.
Edited by Doug Jones on 18 January 2005 at 1:09am
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Arvid Spejare
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 April 2004
Location: Sweden
Posts: 386
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| Posted: 18 January 2005 at 3:54am | IP Logged | 6
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Some new pics (don't want to screw up the width of the page)
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0501/17/b0.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0501/17/b1.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0501/17/b3.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0501/17/b7.jpg
http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0501/17/b8.jpg
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John Byrne
Robot Wrangler
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 102266
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| Posted: 18 January 2005 at 7:51am | IP Logged | 7
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What I don't like, based on the photos, is the notion
that parts of Batman's identity, like the gloves, are
influenced by these same experts.
******
Blame the books. I don't think it has been
suggested that Bruce got elements of the costume
from others, but the design of the gloves (as seen in
the new movie) clearly indicates that people have
forgotten those are stylize bat wings adorning the
gauntlets, not little razor blades.
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John Byrne
Robot Wrangler
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 102266
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| Posted: 18 January 2005 at 7:57am | IP Logged | 8
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http://www.comicscontinuum.com/stories/0501/17/b0.jpg
*****
Why don't they ever pad the shoulders?
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John Byrne
Robot Wrangler
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 102266
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| Posted: 17 April 2005 at 8:42am | IP Logged | 9
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Restarting this thread to note that, despite original misgivings, I am more and more convinced this will not be so bad after all. There are a couple of glitches in the longest trailer I have seen -- Alfred's "Master Wayne" line, and the bat-gauntlets worn by the Liam Neeson character are small examples -- but overall. . . cautious optimism.And if we can in any way hope the "Does it come in black?" line, replete with twinkle in the eye, is how they are going to portray Batman --- well, I might even like this movie!
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Aaron Leach
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 19 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 364
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| Posted: 17 April 2005 at 9:45am | IP Logged | 10
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I'm keeping an open mind to this film, and walking in with no expectations. As for Batman having many teachers, I think it makes more sense. He does have a ton of money to pay for this type of endeavor, and I have always looked at the Batman character as a perfectionist. Why wouldn't you want to learn from the best, if you were going to take on this type of life mission?
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Martin Kogan
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 13 July 2004
Location: Argentina
Posts: 1477
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| Posted: 17 April 2005 at 9:52am | IP Logged | 11
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Have you seen the TV ads? They show Batman in motion and I think it's a million times better than the "I only kick once or twice in this movie" Keaton Batman.
mk
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John Byrne
Robot Wrangler
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 102266
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| Posted: 17 April 2005 at 10:46am | IP Logged | 12
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As for Batman having many teachers, I think it makes
more sense. He does have a ton of money to pay for
this type of endeavor, and I have always looked at the
Batman character as a perfectionist. Why wouldn't
you want to learn from the best, if you were going to
take on this type of life mission?
******
The comics established decades ago that Batman
had many teachers. I used this as the core of "The
Many Deaths of the Batman".
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Topic Closed)
