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Knut Robert Knutsen Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 22 September 2006 Posts: 7374
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Posted: 19 July 2010 at 8:43am | IP Logged | 1
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I like my idea of flashing lights and an air raid siren better. Any option that involves me being anywhere an intruder might see me or get to me or my family is not a good one. For all I know, he might have robbed a neighbour first, found a loaded gun in the bedside table and brought it with him. No. Wait. I don't live in the US. Phew.
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Brad Krawchuk Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 19 June 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 5814
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Posted: 19 July 2010 at 8:59am | IP Logged | 2
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Doesn't it achieve the same result without risk of accidentally killing other people?
---
I read this and immediately thought there's plenty of risk when it comes to accidentally killing someone with a taser. It's happened more than a few times. Of course, the key word here is accidentally.
When used properly, and on a person without underlying medical conditions, a taser is not meant to kill. So dying from one could only be accidental!
A gun on the other hand... aim at center mass and take two shots is the proper way to use one on a person. Sounds lethal to me!
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 134212
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Posted: 19 July 2010 at 9:06am | IP Logged | 3
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So often it has been said that guns and cigarettes are the only mass produced products that, when used PROPERLY, kill people.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 134212
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Posted: 19 July 2010 at 9:10am | IP Logged | 4
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I'll do what is necessary to prevent any harm to myself or my wife. If that entails holding the perp at gunpoint until the police arrive, then so be it. If the perp is hell bent on harming me or my wife and I cannot safely exit my home well then, he chose his fate. It's going to be either him or us. What would be your choice?•• Not to be so %^ing paranoid! Seriously, I wonder what kind of scenario you imagine, in which a bad guy intent on doing harm to you and your loved ones had entered your home and cornered you in such a way that there is no escape --- and yet you can still get to your gun!
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Brad Krawchuk Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 19 June 2006 Location: Canada Posts: 5814
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Posted: 19 July 2010 at 9:56am | IP Logged | 5
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I'm scared of werewolves.
I still go out on nights when there's a full moon though. I figure there's a 50-50 chance. I either get attacked by one, or I don't.
People could die crossing the street without paying full attention. People get killed being inattentive in cars all the time. Accidents happen at work, school, home. Hell, I could die while typing this - who's to say I'm not about to have a stroke or suffer some form of massive blood loss because I've got an undiagnosed hole in my aorta?
Want to live a life in fear of both rational and irrational things, then by all means DO get a gun... and blow your brains out. Because the odds of being in a situation where you'll NEED the gun to defend yourself are far outweighed by the BILLIONS of creative ways man and nature has of killing us without so much as a criminal offense.
Edited by Brad Krawchuk on 19 July 2010 at 9:57am
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 134212
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Posted: 19 July 2010 at 10:13am | IP Logged | 6
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Clearly, guns give some people a sense of empowerment. We can skip all the Freudian analysis about guns being phallic substitutes, and just focus on the simple fact that guns let the gun owner kill people. S/He may claim this is not his/her principle concern, and yet strolling thru this thread we see time and time again that guns are viewed as the ultimate problem solvers. As noted, that even HAVING guns by default turns them into something other than a last resort. ("Why should I wait? I can blow the m*therf*cker away before he hurts me!")Americans as a species are very concerned about empowerment. It lies at the heart of most conspiracy theories, for instance. The Government/Big Oil/Big Tobacco/the Commies, etc, are Out to Get Me, but I KNOW they are, so immediately I have the advantage. I am EMPOWERED. This can be very important when, in reality, the individual has no real power at all. And, of course, guns are REAL power. A 98lb weakling can take down a 300lb attacker, if he has a gun and his opponent doesn't. Yet, as I note above, the scenario in which the gun protects the homeowner and his loved ones from an intruder bent on doing them harm has certain elements automatically left out. Like, where is the gun? How easy is it to get to? Is it kept loaded? And if so, why are you endangering your loved ones yourself? "Let's play with Daddy's gun!" Harrumph harrumph say the gun owners. "I have taught my kids not to do that." Sure. And the parents of the five year olds who shoot their brothers/sisters/neighbors/mailman think they did the same thing.
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Thom Price Byrne Robotics Member
LHomme Diabolique
Joined: 29 April 2004 Location: United States Posts: 7592
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Posted: 19 July 2010 at 10:26am | IP Logged | 7
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Tasers are illegal in 7 states, plus Washingting DC. Handguns are legal in all 50 states. Try to follow that logic.
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Scott Daggett Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 26 February 2008 Posts: 837
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Posted: 19 July 2010 at 10:31am | IP Logged | 8
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I'm not going to elaborate further with "what if" scenarios and I am not paranoid. I live in a very quiet community just outside of a small city (New Bedford) with a population of 100,000 that has it's fair share of problems just like every other community. Gangs, drug dealers and an occasional whacko have left their mark on neighboring communities. All I want to do is live my life and further my search for liberty and the pursuit of happiness. I am a peaceful person but I have no problem doing whatever needs to be done to protect myself and my wife if necessary. ******************************** Seriously, I wonder what kind of scenario you imagine, in which a bad guy intent on doing harm to you and your loved ones had entered your home and cornered you in such a way that there is no escape --- and yet you can still get to your gun! ********************************* To be serious for just a moment JB. My bedroom is on the second floor of my Cape Cod style home. My front door opens up with the staircase just to the left of the front door. If a perp were to come up those stairs, I have no way to safely exit my home. I suppose I could jump out a second story window down to the ground below but then, that would not be a safe exit. I can effectively "still get to my gun" because my gun cabinet is in my bedroom.
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Kurtis J. Evans Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 18 June 2010 Location: Canada Posts: 133
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Posted: 19 July 2010 at 10:39am | IP Logged | 9
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One of the interesting things I once read (maybe here?) ...
An appropriately safe gun owner keeps his or her weapons locked in a cabinet or safe.
Unless you live in a mansion, any intruder can probably get to any point in your home in under 30 seconds. (Maybe even in under 15 seconds ... try it sometime. Have somebody time how long it takes for you to get from the front door to the room that's farthest from.)
Unless you are leaving that cabinet unlocked, it very well might take you just as long -- if not longer, should it be secured by a combination lock! -- to actually get your gun. (Try it. Have the same person time how long it takes you to roll out of bed, secure your key, run over to the cabinet, unlock it, grab your gun, load it -- because it's dangerous to leave a gun loaded, even if it's in a safe! -- and release the safety.)
In other words, the only way to be truly "protected" may very well be to have that gun under your pillow, or in the dresser by the side of your bed ... which is extremely dangerous should you have a child of any age in the house, regardless of how well you prepare them with gun safety.
Just a thought.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 134212
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Posted: 19 July 2010 at 10:40am | IP Logged | 10
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To be serious for just a moment JB. My bedroom is on the second floor of my Cape Cod style home. My front door opens up with the staircase just to the left of the front door. If a perp were to come up those stairs, I have no way to safely exit my home. I suppose I could jump out a second story window down to the ground below but then, that would not be a safe exit.I can effectively "still get to my gun" because my gun cabinet is in my bedroom. •• So, now we begin to see the Plan fraying at the edges. You open with a scenario in which your gun is a last line of defense against an aggressor who is bent upon doing harm to you and your loved ones. But this has become a scenario in which you are grabbing your gun as soon as the bad guy comes thru the door. You are ASSUMING his intent is to do you harm, when in fact, knowing you to be upstairs in the bedroom, he might restrict his movements to the ground floor. And this is assuming he conveniently breaks in when you are IN your bedroom, and near you gun cabinet.* What if he comes in while you're in the kitchen? What if he has a gun? How dead are you, before you get to your gun cabinet? Maybe everybody should have a shoulder holster. Or maybe we should all carry our guns on our hips like Wyatt Earp. The fact is, in any scenario in which the home owner imagines a gun is going to protect him/her from an intruder, there are a whole string of assumptions as to how easily the gun will be accessed, and how much time the intruder is going to allow for that access (not much, I'm guessing). So, unless you are planning on emerging from your bedroom with guns blazing, at the first sound of someone coming up the stairs, seems like your plan of "protection" doesn't amount to much. In fact, it seems like your notion of "self-defense" is a whole lot closer to cold blooded murder. --- * Gun cabinet in the bedroom. That just makes my head hurt.
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John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005 Posts: 134212
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Posted: 19 July 2010 at 10:42am | IP Logged | 11
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And take the scenario suggested by Kurtis, and have the person manning the stop watch shouting at you the whole time, just to make sure you are properly off-balance, as you most certainly would be if you thought an invader was in your house!
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Scott Daggett Byrne Robotics Member

Joined: 26 February 2008 Posts: 837
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Posted: 19 July 2010 at 10:44am | IP Logged | 12
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Sorry for your headache Mr. Byrne.
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