| Author |
|
Sam Karns
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 26 December 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 7624
|
| Posted: 22 April 2009 at 2:16am | IP Logged | 1
|
|
|
If JB would be hired to approach She-Hulk again I would hope he would leave the 90's approach behind him. I think Jennifer Walters need something fresh and there is one person who could make her fresh again. I wish Marvel would produce GN again.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Matt Reed
Byrne Robotics Security
Robotmod
Joined: 16 April 2004
Posts: 35945
|
| Posted: 22 April 2009 at 10:01am | IP Logged | 2
|
|
|
I don't have to read into anything, Paul. You supplied that quote twice and the second time you condescendingly said "I'll help you with a bold hint" as if I couldn't read. Anyone reading what I posted in reply to you could tell that I was, in fact, reading everything. The summation the author supplied isn't what you so "kindly" hinted at. It's at the end of Nightmare's speech otherwise why include that caveat at all? In context of the story and explicitly dealing with what Nightmare said, it's intentionally left ambiguous. If you want to think that it was all Nightmare screwing with him ignoring what the author wrote, then that's your prerogative. I don't think it's left definitively either way and that's the problem I have with the story in a nutshell. Banner, at least the Banner I know, would ultimately never be tormented by the absurdities that Nightmare threw at him because in his heart he would know that he never intended to blow up a school, knew he never spoke to an ethereal Hulk long before the Gamma Bomb explosion that created him, never met General Ross until long after high school. That PAD made him question everything and then idiotically leave it open ended as if Banner himself doesn't know up from down is absurd given the character he was writing.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 14857
|
| Posted: 22 April 2009 at 10:28am | IP Logged | 3
|
|
|
There are a few female wrestlers who I think would make good casting physically for female superheroes. Chyna is not one of them.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Michael Roberts
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 14857
|
| Posted: 22 April 2009 at 10:42am | IP Logged | 4
|
|
|
I'm just disagreeing with your original point of contention, which was
that you implied that PAD had "Banner speaking to the Hulk in his mind
during high school years before the Gamma Bomb accident". In the
context of the story, as it eventually turned out, this was all part of
Nightmare's "torment".
That's my take, at any rate.
---
I'd suggest reading the story again. Once Nightmare has been revealed and delivered the speech about what the Hulk thinks he knows may or may not be real, the story cuts to a flashback of a young Thunderbolt Ross visiting Banner's mother after the incident. It's revealed that the Army had looked over his notebooks, saw his potential for weapons designing, and wanted to be involved in Bruce's education.
Bruce is in the hospital, so this isn't a memory. It's possible that this scene was an interpretation of what Bruce was told in his fake memories of trying to blow up his school, but that would be horrible storytelling.
It's important to note that when Nightmare tells the Hulk, "And to tell you whatever you think you know... may or may not be real," we see images of the Devil Hulk (from Paul Jenkins' run), the Abomination, and the Absorbing Man (both used in the Bruce Jones run) behind Nightmare. That statement seems to more about retconning away elements of those runs. (Definitely with the Bruce Jones run, since the developments with Dr. Samson and Absorbing Man during that run were subsequently ignored.)
Edited by Michael Roberts on 22 April 2009 at 10:43am
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Paul W. Sondersted, Jr.
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 276
|
| Posted: 22 April 2009 at 11:25am | IP Logged | 5
|
|
|
Matt Reed wrote:
| I don't have to read into anything, Paul |
|
|
Hmmmm. You implied that I was being "snotty", which is inaccurate. You read INTO typed words and you read INTO those typed words inaccurately. No biggie. A lot of people do that on the 'Net.
Matt Reed wrote:
| You supplied that quote twice and the second time you condescendingly said "I'll help you with a bold hint" as if I couldn't read. |
|
|
As I mentioned in my last post, "My intention is not to be snooty at all. I honestly thought that you were only reading what you wanted to read & if I'm wrong about that, then I apologize."
Snotty and/or condescension was not my intent. Please back away from making assumptions. You're starting to tread down a path of defensiveness and this is not necessary. We SHOULD be able to discuss our differences of opinion without needing to jump to certain conclusions based on type-written words.
Matt Reed wrote:
| Anyone reading what I posted in reply to you could tell that I was, in fact, reading everything. |
|
|
And I apologized for my error, did I not?
-----
In regards to your opinions about the story elements as written by PAD, I can understand why you would come to these conclusions.
Here's my take:
The Nightmare character managed to get into Bruce Banner's head. Bruce Banner may be able to avoid certain torments/demons, etc., while he is awake & in complete control of his faculties (and that's a whole 'nother ball of wax with Bruce Banner, isn't it?), he was in a form of Nightmare's realm, which is the dream realm, and aren't pretty much all bets off when you're in the dream realm? I know from personal experience and also from reading literature on dreams, that people do & say & think about things in their dreams that they would never even consider doing or saying or thinking about while they are awake.
In fact, in the story that PAD wrote, Bruce Banner manages to win against Nightmare, mainly because he realizes that things aren't what they seem to be (that's a simplification on my part, of course). Nightmare tried to take advantage of Bruce Banner and the reason that he didn't win was because Bruce Banner finally woke up & realized he was being manipulated.
In other words, as you say, "in his heart he would know that he never intended to blow up a school,
knew he never spoke to an ethereal Hulk long before the Gamma Bomb
explosion that created him, never met General Ross until long after
high school."
In his head, though? While in a dream-state? Even Nightmare made a similar statement to what you imply...
Nightmare to the Hulk after the Hulk claims to be bored & is going to walk away: "Really. As If you could. As if I were not capable of burrowing so deeply into your mind that you literally won't know if you're coming or going."
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Tom French
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 07 January 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 4154
|
| Posted: 22 April 2009 at 11:33am | IP Logged | 6
|
|
|
Brandon Routh had to play Christopher Reeve to make it perfect, and buddy he nailed the part.
I couldn't disagree with this more. Roth didn't come anywhere near the grace and depth that Reeve brought to the role. Roth did "Reeve-isms," not play the role(s) of Clark Kent/ Superman. He lacked Reeve's charisma and presence -- as well as Superman's -- but he tried to imitate Reeve's performance rather than recreate it.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Arc Carlton
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 13 April 2009
Location: Peru
Posts: 3493
|
| Posted: 22 April 2009 at 11:38am | IP Logged | 7
|
|
|
Evidently Christopher Reeve was a much better actor.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Paul W. Sondersted, Jr.
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 276
|
| Posted: 22 April 2009 at 11:51am | IP Logged | 8
|
|
|
I wrote:
I'm just disagreeing with your original point of contention, which was
that you implied that PAD had "Banner speaking to the Hulk in his mind
during high school years before the Gamma Bomb accident". In the
context of the story, as it eventually turned out, this was all part of
Nightmare's "torment".
That's my take, at any rate. |
|
|
Michael Roberts wrote:
I'd suggest reading the story again. Once Nightmare has been
revealed and delivered the speech about what the Hulk thinks he knows
may or may not be real, the story cuts to a flashback of a young
Thunderbolt Ross visiting Banner's mother after the incident. It's
revealed that the Army had looked over his notebooks, saw his potential
for weapons designing, and wanted to be involved in Bruce's education.
Bruce
is in the hospital, so this isn't a memory. It's possible that this
scene was an interpretation of what Bruce was told in his fake memories
of trying to blow up his school, but that would be horrible
storytelling. |
|
|
Yup. I just checked that out & it seems to me that that page doesn't belong there, if you take into account that we're going by the rest of story as coming from Bruce Banner's memories...and as you imply that cut-scene doesn't originate from Bruce Banner's memories. That's a definite mistake...IMO.
Michael Roberts wrote:
| It's important to note that when Nightmare tells the Hulk, "And to tell
you whatever you think you know... may or may not be real," we see
images of the Devil Hulk (from Paul Jenkins' run), the Abomination, and
the Absorbing Man (both used in the Bruce Jones run) behind Nightmare.
That statement seems to more about retconning away elements of those
runs. (Definitely with the Bruce Jones run, since the developments with
Dr. Samson and Absorbing Man during that run were subsequently ignored.) |
|
|
I think it's wishful thinking on PAD's part, to do away with that stuff. If you recall, there's a scene in that very issue in which Bruce Banner is in a straight jacket talking with Doc Samson and they talk about everything being a "bad dream", the devil Hulk, the Bruce Jones run, etc. Of course, that's when Bruce Banner realizes everything is not as it seems.
Still, you got me on that cut-scene with Bruce Banner's mom & a younger Thunderbolt Ross. Color me confoozled...at least more so than usual! =)
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Tom French
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 07 January 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 4154
|
| Posted: 22 April 2009 at 11:51am | IP Logged | 9
|
|
|
Christopher??? I meant GEORGE Reeves! My favorite of the Supermen!
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Jeremy Shaffer
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2009
Location: United States
Posts: 41
|
| Posted: 22 April 2009 at 3:31pm | IP Logged | 10
|
|
|
Actors aren't as good as they used to be, you have to judge them by today's standards. Movies used to have to rely on the strength of the actors, now they have special F/X and all kinds of crap.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
Wallace Sellars
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 01 May 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 17699
|
| Posted: 22 April 2009 at 5:22pm | IP Logged | 11
|
|
|
I meant GEORGE Reeves! My favorite of the Supermen!
---
Same here, Tom!
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
|
| |
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 133326
|
| Posted: 22 April 2009 at 6:40pm | IP Logged | 12
|
|
|
George was my favorite Clark Kent. Christopher was my favorite Superman.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Topic Closed)
