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Topic: Alex Toth Critiques Steve Rude’s Pencils (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post ReplyPost New Topic
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 03 August 2008 at 8:46pm | IP Logged | 1  

I've found Rude's approach to storytelling to be rather painter-ly.  He prefers landscapes to establishing shots and would rather allow the readers' eyes to wander about the page rather than put his story and characters front and center. It's a valid, mostly attractive approach, but not as effective as the one Toth advises.

Rude's Moth seems to be an attempt at old-fashioned cartoony action, but as listed here in this thread, he has a number of problems in presenting the necessary information to the reader that it takes for the page to "read" clearly. That being said, it still works; just not as well as it otherwise might.

Toth is a man whose difficult reputation preceded him.  If one has actually imposed upon his time for a favor as large as a detailed multi-page critique, one might wish to reconsider repaying his generosity with excuses and contradictions.  Yeah, I would imagine Toth became angry.  In what story ever told about the man is he not angry?  Most of his own tales from the comics and animation industries have him blowing his stack at the know-it-alls and know-nothings surrounding him on all sides.  Rude got Toth's opinion on his work, take it or leave it.  Trying to correct Toth's assumptions, however good-naturedly ("Y'see, you said I should establish the Quest family as characters, but that was already done in the first chapter...") is unwise and presumptutious. Say "thank you" and use his advice or don't.  Rude apparently has chosen not to use it.  Fine.  His choice.  Fortunately, the rest of us get to benefit from this inside look at Toth's approach.

 

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Paulo Pereira
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Posted: 03 August 2008 at 9:01pm | IP Logged | 2  

Still, one should be allowed to ask for clarification without being cussed at.  Also, if Rude says he didn't fake anything, then should we give him the benefit of the doubt?
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Brian Hague
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Posted: 03 August 2008 at 9:10pm | IP Logged | 3  

We can do whatever we like, but Toth found the drawings unconvincing, and therefore "fake."  Toth seemed to think further research would have corrected the problem, and never had any problem with taking the time and doing the research himself.  Why expect less of others?

Asking for clarification without being cussed at isn't a given, either. Toth cussed out any number of people for any number of reasons.  There's no reason to assume you're going to be immune, especially if you're correcting and second-guessing the man. Again, he'd taken his time to do you a favor.  Say "thank you" and leave it at that.  "Thank you, but..." is only going to lead to trouble.

 

 

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Joe Hollon
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 2:36am | IP Logged | 4  

Re: Spider-Man/Medusa sketch on previous page...

" Now what would Toth say about this?"

*****

I would say it's a decent sketch assuming Rude intended it to depict the moment Spider-Man's crime-fighting career was ended as his left tibia and fibula were shattered by Medusa's hair.




Edited by Joe Hollon on 04 August 2008 at 2:39am
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Michael Retour
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 9:42am | IP Logged | 5  

Joe you're right.  I'd love to own that sketch with the broken tibia and fibula!  You? 

Medusa is sort of smirking and Spider-Man is looking right at the broken tibia and fibula that she just swung around and snapped. 

I think a lot of artists wish they were as good as Rude and could paint like he can.  His paintings depict movement, unlike someone like Alex Ross.  The only time I've ever seen Ross' paintings show movement is when he re-created another artist's work.  A Kirby piece Ross painted over gave it movement but it was Kirby that gave it the movement and not Ross.

Is the Moth #3 cover below the issue we are talking about?  I will go dig it out and take a look.




Edited by Michael Retour on 04 August 2008 at 11:59am
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Andy Mokler
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 11:45am | IP Logged | 6  

Something I haven't been able to figure out, did Toth actually want to give this critique at all?  From what I've gathered, it seems Rude had to ask more than once and if Toth was as surly(?) as is being told, I imagine being pestered about a critique would not put him in the best of moods. 

No artist is perfect and examples of poor storytelling can probably be found in just about anyone's work but breaking certain fundamental rules shouldn't be acceptable just because the one doing it is a "name" or "legend".  Continuity and storytelling are what ground the reality and help the fantasy to work.  They shouldn't be sacrificed for convenience.
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Al Cook
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 2:49pm | IP Logged | 7  

 Bosch Fawstin wrote:
And if I were the kind of self-promoter I'm
called out for being, I'd be posting what he had to say about my first
graphic novel right here.


Five posts later...

 Bosch Fawstin wrote:
Here's what Alex Toth had to say about my first
graphic novel, Table for One, which I break down as 'Dirty Harry as a
waiter.'...


Guess all those people calling you out are right.

Cool.
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Knut Robert Knutsen
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 2:54pm | IP Logged | 8  

Hey, Al. I already pointed that out in the "Bosch Fawstin self love thread".

He said it was all my fault for not hugging him when he was a child.

(So you totally swiped my "Gotcha!". You ... Swiper you. )

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Michael Huber
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 2:58pm | IP Logged | 9  

Al, I noticed that too, but to voice it gives it power, you know?
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Al Cook
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 3:10pm | IP Logged | 10  

Too true, Michael.

I will do my best to never draw attention to whatshisname ever again.
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Michael Huber
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 3:13pm | IP Logged | 11  

There ya go. There has to be something else to comment on, maybe another Darren Taylor pic in the sketch thread?
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Al Cook
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Posted: 04 August 2008 at 3:59pm | IP Logged | 12  

Ha! (I wish Darren would occasionally post something other than
cheesecake. I think people are starting to get the idea that that is
solely what I'm complimenting him on, but the man is good! Check out his
"This Life" strip sometime, or the concept work he's been doing for his job.
He's got some serious talent.)
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