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Tom French
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Posted: 30 September 2008 at 9:07am | IP Logged | 1  

Always nice to see states like Montana leading the pack, eh?  C'mon, cliche liberal blue coastal states, get with the program!!!!!
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Geoff Gibson
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Posted: 30 September 2008 at 9:38am | IP Logged | 2  

I thought (but don't know) that many of those states already have pro-gay adoption rules on the books.  The question, I suppose, is how would an adoptive, non-married straight couple be treated and how would their gay counterparts be treated, should there be custody issues following a breakup. 

Taking the Montana case's facts heres an interesting dispute: the mother, now married dies (God forbid).  Who has custody of the kids?  The other mother or the adoptive mother's husband?  Would the Court award him custody or would they placed with their other mother (assuming he has not moved to adopt the kids)?   If he has adopted who has the better right of custody.  Think of the interesting (legally speaking) arguments! (Get your Blue Book out Tom!)

Here is the language that warms my heart from the Court:

In his ruling Monday, District Judge Ed McLean wrote: "To discriminate further against Ms. Kulstad because of her sexual preference in this day and age is no different than telling a person to go to the back of the bus because of her skin color." 

Love it.  Yay for Judge Ed!  Lets hope if there is an Appeals Court they follow his lead.

 



Edited by Geoff Gibson on 30 September 2008 at 9:39am
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Jodi Moisan
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Posted: 30 September 2008 at 9:42am | IP Logged | 3  

Great, until they appeal this to the U.S Supreme Court, which being more conservative they will over turn this.

 

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Donald Miller
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Posted: 30 September 2008 at 9:53am | IP Logged | 4  

Wait a tic, I am confused by  this....The other mother or the adoptive mother's husband?

Aren't both mothers adoptive mothers?  shouldn't this be viewed as two parents adopt a kid, they get divorced and share custody...one of them gets married and then dies...that new spouse(call them step) should perhaps get visitation rights depending on length of time involved in the children's lives, but otherwise, other adoptive parent trumps.

I agree with the judge, was confused about the wording here...did only one parent adopt?


and Jodi, I never see you as this pessimistic.  are you ok?  No matter how conservative...I don't see, depending on how the adoption was written up, stripping a parent of their rights as go situation here...that would be unconscionable.

Don
Don

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Donald Miller
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Posted: 30 September 2008 at 9:57am | IP Logged | 5  

Okay I am an idiot and didn't read the article first.  

Hooray judge!  treating this parent as an equal partner even without the designation of spouse.  Good common sense judgement...if this person spent ten years being a partner and parent to these children, then obviously she should have parental rights...it's not just about genetics and paper trails...Good Show judge.

Don
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Geoff Gibson
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Posted: 30 September 2008 at 10:02am | IP Logged | 6  

Its a confusing use of language I admit Don! By court action the "other" mother is now also an adoptive mother.  But when the children were legally adopted only one of the women in the relationship could adopt as Montana didn't recognize same sex joint adoptions (e.g. both partners are adoptive parents).  The way around such a heinous law is that one of the partners adopts and the other doesn't.  The court ruled* that such a restriction was unfair based solely on sexual orientation.

*Because of typically poor reporting, what the Court ruled is actually kind of unclear as the report doesn't not provide the specific legal basis for the decision.



Edited by Geoff Gibson on 30 September 2008 at 10:03am
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Donald Miller
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Posted: 30 September 2008 at 10:04am | IP Logged | 7  

Thanks Geoff!

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Geoff Gibson
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Posted: 30 September 2008 at 10:07am | IP Logged | 8  

Great, until they appeal this to the U.S Supreme Court, which being more conservative they will over turn this.

Always possible, of course by the time it gets the Court the Court may be more liberal or quite the same, this election will help decide that!

What the cases raises, I think, is a question of significant importance, vis a vis, civil rights.  Heretofore, homosexuals have not been treated as a protected class, not in the way say race is.  I think its incontrovertible that homosexuals are discriminated against but they are not legally afforded the same type of protection from discrimination that say, african americans are.  Its why I appreciated that language I quoted.  Its why I LOVE the California Supreme Court decision from earlier last year.  Thats the path, to my mind at least, to equality.

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Jodi Moisan
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Posted: 30 September 2008 at 10:54am | IP Logged | 9  

and Jodi, I never see you as this pessimistic.  are you ok?

I am having a really shitty week. Here's why, I would love to have some thoughts.

My older sister is a person that always had personal issues, drinking and drugs as a teen/young adult, even after stopping that she has never had her head screwed on straight. Well she married a guy because he was wealthy, they had 2 kids, both girls, became bitter being tied down to the kids and a man she didn't love. Abused the husband and kids. I confronted her all the time and finally the husband had the balls to leave her, he tried to get custody with my help.

His problem was, he never called the police on her, he had married her because he loved her. So there was no proof to the abuse. I did not witness first hand all the abuse because I lived in Indiana and she in Florida. She of course cut all contact with me. The girls were 5 and under when all of this took place, they are now 17 and 16. My sister and I had opened our relationship up again about 5 years ago, well my 16 year old niece came to stay with us this summer and 5 days before she came, my sister tells me she beat Chandler with a belt , enough to leave bruises. I didn't say anything because I was afraid she would stop the visit. Chandler came and explained what happened and has been happening for as long as she can remember. MacKenzie the oldest had moved in with her father because of my sisters behavior, I was sick , I told Chandler that if the hitting continued to call the police and I would do all that I could, to never let it happen again.

Well it happened again this weekend, long story short, I am giving this week a statement to the CPS to get the father sole custody. I feel so frustrated because when I testified the first time, when they were little about the abuse, those girls should have been safe. I find out the abuse never stopped and it has made me sick to think my sister has done this. I understand about fighting with a spouse, but to hurt a child is beyond horrible in my mind. I love my sister, but hate her actions.

The thing that really makes me mad, there are some in my family that stopped talking to me because I did not side with my sister, it honestly boggles my mind. I apologize for being crappy, but as I said, this is just a completely crappy week.   



Edited by Jodi Moisan on 30 September 2008 at 10:57am
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Geoff Gibson
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Posted: 30 September 2008 at 10:58am | IP Logged | 10  

I'll keep talkin' to you Jodi! You're a hero in my eyes!

Edited to add:

I was eating lunch when I posted before so I wanted to supplement my response.  I think you did the absolute right thing, Jodi.  No doubt you had reservations but you have to balance those reservations against your gut and your judgment.  Doing otherwise would be a disservice to your neices and, funny enough, you sister.  It sounds like she needs help and you're the first in your familiy to see that.  Give the rest of them time, it does heal all wounds, and they will come around.  When people are sick like your sister is they can't hide it.  In the interim stand by your nieces and convictions.  You have been an agent of good (like Captain America, or Superman, or Luke Skywalker, or Wonder Woman, or Ronald Reagan* . . . . .)

*Added to give Jodi a giggle.



Edited by Geoff Gibson on 30 September 2008 at 11:19am
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Al Cook
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Posted: 30 September 2008 at 11:20am | IP Logged | 11  

Mine as well.
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Jodi Moisan
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Posted: 30 September 2008 at 11:25am | IP Logged | 12  

Geoff and Al thanks , sad thing is,  I didn't do enough, so hero is the last thing I am feeling. Chandler is a doll she was delightful when she stayed with us, she is a straight A student, doesn't drink, do drugs and she isn't boy crazy. She has great goals, she is in ROTC right now and wants to join the military after high school, go to college and be a doctor (her IQ has been tested at 180 ).  I am so proud that she has not let what has been happening be an excuse to do bad things.

She and her sister are remarkable young ladies.

Here is a picture from their visit 2 years ago, there is a big fairy event in our community and I made her the fairy costume, Jackson didn't want to dress up so the costume is one the nighbor had that was a Peter Pan costume, we told him he could carry a sword.



Edited by Jodi Moisan on 30 September 2008 at 11:26am
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