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Brian Hunt
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5178
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| Posted: 20 February 2008 at 12:57pm | IP Logged | 1
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One effing time and now im an asshole
Only because you knew that the original artist had never been compensated. That's the kicker. You knew that Ditton was pulling an end around on JB and you went along with it. It was an error in judgement, and we understand. But don't get too bent out of shape because you're called on it. Just flip the situation around and ask yourself how would you feel if Ditton had taken your piece to JB and never paid you? IMHO, the golden rule works in this situation.
On an aside, I'm sorry to hear about your Father. My thoughts are with you and your family.
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Gerry Turnbull
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: Scotland
Posts: 8766
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| Posted: 20 February 2008 at 12:57pm | IP Logged | 2
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Eric, what makes you think im confusing you, or responding to anything youve said?
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Al Cook
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 21 December 2004
Posts: 12736
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| Posted: 20 February 2008 at 12:58pm | IP Logged | 3
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QUOTE:
Because Ditton commissioned a "tracing" of the first he has
effectively said "I want this piece!" Wich is the exact opposite of what he said
to JB's art dealer. |
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Excellent point.
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Anthony castrillo
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 February 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 781
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| Posted: 20 February 2008 at 12:58pm | IP Logged | 4
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No, i understand why some are offended, they are protecting what they see
as their own. I should apologize for flaring up. Im not one to jump up and
down when confronted, i tend to ignore people i dont know, though their
opinions may be valid, i really could care less.
And thanks Jesus, but needing money is a constant for freelance artist,
regardless of the situation.
I take offense to the "stole" description. John, if he hasnt sold it allready still
has the work, what we are talking about here is a copy by a no name artist.
So, let this thread go on cause in the long run their are more pressing
matters that i have to concern myself with.
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Anthony J Lombardi
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 12 January 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 9410
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| Posted: 20 February 2008 at 12:58pm | IP Logged | 5
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Quote:
I don't think for one second Anthony owes Byrne any money.
Ditton does and I'll ask Ar this: If Byrne took Ditton to small claims court,
would he get a judgement in his favor? I say yes! | | |
I suspect you're right, Eric. I do know I'd be loathe to actually sell Ditton
the piece at this point if I were JB, but it would at least make the matter
of payment owed go away.
buying the piece or art doesn't fix the problem Al buying the original piece and also paying J.B. for using his work in the commissiong of another piece of work settles the matter.
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Thom Price
Byrne Robotics Member
L’Homme Diabolique
Joined: 29 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 7593
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| Posted: 20 February 2008 at 12:59pm | IP Logged | 6
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Thom, what do you suggest be done about it?
***
That's entirely between Mr. Byrne and the other two parties. I merely find it interesting -- in a negative, sad sort of way -- that no matter how bad someone's behavior there will always be people willing to defend it. Artists swiping the work of other artists is a pretty gray area, but at least the artist whose work is being ripped off originally got paid. JB did not. That nudges this firmly into shades of black, as far as I'm concerned. That the copying artist knew the original creator wasn't paid for his work eliminated any doubt.
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Scott Nickel
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 10 July 2005
Location: United States
Posts: 132
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| Posted: 20 February 2008 at 12:59pm | IP Logged | 7
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We need more analogies. Analogies are the best.
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Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
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| Posted: 20 February 2008 at 12:59pm | IP Logged | 8
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One must ask, is the work in question merely a depiction of two well-known comic book characters, or is it Byrne's depiction of the characters?
In other words, Ditton didn't just approach Castrillo for a reinterpreation of the original piece. The point was to obtain an original, made-to-order, John Byrne commission without having to pay Byrne. It wouldn't have taken much reflection for either Ditton or Castrillo to see this.
Arguments can be made for either man's redeeming qualities and talents, and I'm sure they have plenty. But it doesn't make what they did less wrong.
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Darren Taylor
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 April 2004
Location: Scotland
Posts: 6024
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| Posted: 20 February 2008 at 12:59pm | IP Logged | 9
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"He knew he was blatantly copying the work of an artist who had not been paid for his work. Pretty clear to me. "-Thom
Great I feel happier for you now. What exactly are you -clear- about? In your "culpability" graph, where does Ditton rank?
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Eric White
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 October 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 1067
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| Posted: 20 February 2008 at 1:00pm | IP Logged | 10
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Eric, what makes you think im confusing you, or responding to anything
youve said?
Because Gerry, the comment Anthony was commenting on was mine and he
confused me with Mike and the comment about seeing Anthony on other
messageboards was mine, not Mike's.
If you're talking about something else, I apologize.
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Paulo Pereira
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 24 April 2006
Posts: 15539
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| Posted: 20 February 2008 at 1:01pm | IP Logged | 11
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Agreed, Thom, but whatever else one might say about Pat Ditton (or even Anthony Castrillo), he did offer to pay for the original piece. There is a light at the end of this tunnel there, I'd wager.
Edited by Paulo Pereira on 20 February 2008 at 1:03pm
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Jeff Albertson
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 24 March 2007
Location: United States
Posts: 451
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| Posted: 20 February 2008 at 1:03pm | IP Logged | 12
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I agree with JB about the design fee concept. I think that's the only fair way to handle situations like this.
JB, is there a typical design fee amount paid to Jack Kirby when doing the FF 1 homages that Pat could use as a guideline? Obviously, I imagine the fee could vary between what Amazing Heroes or Marvel would have paid and what you would have paid for your own characters.
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Topic Closed)
