Active Topics | Member List | Search | Help | Register | Login
The John Byrne Forum
Byrne Robotics > The John Byrne Forum << Prev Page of 146 Next >>
Topic: Spider-Man rebooted (spoilers) (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post ReplyPost New Topic
Author
Message
Matt Reed
Byrne Robotics Security
Avatar
Robotmod

Joined: 16 April 2004
Posts: 35941
Posted: 03 January 2008 at 12:08pm | IP Logged | 1  

 Glenn Greenberg wrote:
Only that there's no stigma or "black mark" attached to divorce
anymore

I don't know about that one, Glenn, particularly at the time you were at Marvel and discussing Peter and MJ divorcing as a possible solution to ending the marriage.  I got a divorce in 1992 and there was still a stigma surrounding it, nearly all of it negative.  Sideways glances, disapproving looks, whispers behind my back.  If that happened to me, I can't see how it wouldn't happen to Peter in the MU as well as among his readership.  I'd be hard pressed to say that the stigma of divorce is totally gone.  It's still a massive sign of failure and something you carry with you for the rest of your life.  We've seen Gwen dredged up at every opportunity. What's to say that Peter's divorce, yet another touchstone in his aging life (Death of Uncle Ben, later Death of Gwen, later Marriage to MJ, later Divorce from MJ), wouldn't be dredged up time and again because it's a new and shiny emotional crutch?

Back to Top profile | search
 
Glenn Greenberg
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 6746
Posted: 03 January 2008 at 12:44pm | IP Logged | 2  

<<<What's to say that Peter's divorce... wouldn't be dredged up time and
again because it's a new and shiny emotional crutch?>>>

That's why there are EDITORS, Matt--to prevent that from happening!

(Well, maybe not so much anymore, but IDEALLY...)

Didn't know about your own personal situation, by the way. Very sorry
you went through such an unpleasant experience.

But there's a very good reason why I didn't know--you never mentioned
it! So as far as I've known, you were single and always had been!

If the folks who produce the comics followed your lead...


Edited by Glenn Greenberg on 04 January 2008 at 10:50pm
Back to Top profile | search
 
Victor Manuel Fernandez Patiño
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: Mexico
Posts: 1602
Posted: 03 January 2008 at 12:45pm | IP Logged | 3  

Having a single Peter Parker sounds fun, but under Quesada run as EIC sounds scary...

-BTW I don't think having a devil granting wishes to superheroes is a good idea, much less having a superpowered, err.. ex-wife, never wife, unwife? running around-
Back to Top profile | search | www e-mail
 
Bruce Buchanan
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 14 June 2006
Location: United States
Posts: 4797
Posted: 03 January 2008 at 12:47pm | IP Logged | 4  

Well anyway this is good news for grown men who still live with their moms. They finally have a hero they can identify with again: "MOM mustn't know I date other girls! She's so possessive she could just die."

They should've restarted him as an high schooler. Who aspires to be a college student who lives with his mom? Why on earth...

******************

Well....let's not get carried away. There is a precedent for this: Peter graduated high school in ASM #28, but didn't move out until issue #46.

There are many college students who live with their mom, particularly at urban universities (like the fictional Empire State University) that don't have much residential housing. Heck, even those of us who lived on campus in college still came home for holidays and the summer.

I don't think living at home while going to college makes Peter some kind of loser. In fact, in the hands of the right creative team, it could lead to some of the fun Lee/Ditko & Lee/Romita-type stories where Peter must go to great lengths to keep Aunt May from discovering his secret identity. Anyone remember the classic where Aunt May discovers a web dummy Peter left in his bed, causing her to freak out?

Or this could be simply be a prelude to Peter moving back in with Harry, a combination that led to many great stories in the 1970s.



Edited by Bruce Buchanan on 03 January 2008 at 12:49pm
Back to Top profile | search | www e-mail
 
Jason Schulman
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 08 July 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 2473
Posted: 03 January 2008 at 1:55pm | IP Logged | 5  

Having now read the JMS interview at Newsarama...as much as I hated JMS's run on Amazing Spider-Man, he makes one very valid point about the printed version of "One More Day":

"There's this notion that magic fixes everything. It doesn't. 'It's magic, we don't have to explain it.' Well, actually, yes, you do. Magic has to have rules. And this is clearly not just a case of one spell making everybody forget he's Spidey...suddenly you're bringing back the dead, undoing wounds, erasing records, reinstating web shooters, on and on and on.

What I wanted to do was to make one small change to history, a tiny thing, whose ripples we could control to only touch what editorial wanted to touch, making changes we could explain logically. I worked for weeks to come up with a timeline that would leave every other bit of continuity in place. It was rigorous, and as logical as I could make it. In the end of OMD as published, Harry is alive and he's always been alive as far as the characters know...so how is that different than he was alive the whole time?

It made no sense to me.

Still doesn't. It's sloppy. It violates every rule of writing fiction of the fantastic that I and every other SF/Fantasy writer knows you can't violate. It's fantasy 101."


Back to Top profile | search
 
Stephen Robinson
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5835
Posted: 03 January 2008 at 2:15pm | IP Logged | 6  

They should've restarted him as an high schooler. Who aspires to be a college student who lives with his mom? Why on earth...

******************

Well....let's not get carried away. There is a precedent for this: Peter graduated high school in ASM #28, but didn't move out until issue #46.

***********

SER: Yes, but this was partly a result of the original mistake made in having Peter graduate from high school. As pointed out, this makes it difficult to maintain a unique element to the character (a hero who still lives with his "mother") without making the character a complete loser. And yes, I know that many college students live with their parents -- just like many adults do, but the key here is that when you're 12 or even 15, you don't aspire to graduate high school... and stay at home. When Peter was a high school student, it made sense because he was a minor and there was no other option.

Back to Top profile | search | www
 
Paulo Pereira
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 24 April 2006
Posts: 15539
Posted: 03 January 2008 at 2:15pm | IP Logged | 7  


 QUOTE:
It made no sense to me.

Still doesn't. It's sloppy. It violates every rule of writing fiction of the fantastic that I and every other SF/Fantasy writer knows you can't violate. It's fantasy 101."

'Sloppy' seems inadequate somehow.

(BTW, isn't that last sentence bad grammar?)



Edited by Paulo Pereira on 03 January 2008 at 2:17pm
Back to Top profile | search
 
Michael Heide
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 26 July 2007
Location: Germany
Posts: 398
Posted: 03 January 2008 at 2:18pm | IP Logged | 8  

Am I a bad person for still looking forward to Brand New Day? They have great writers, great artists and a setup I can live with. I like Peter working at the Bugle. I like mechanical web-shooters. I like Harry Osborn. I like not even Aunt May knowing Spidey's secret identity.

I mean, seriously, the worst case scenario right now is they retcon the retcon, and we get the status quo we had pre-OMD: Black costume, public identity, totemic powers, marriage intact.

Best case scenario: The Brand New Day stories are fun, and a year from now, nobody cares how they got there.

I think the glass is half-full right now. Because they haven't finished pouring in yet.
Back to Top profile | search
 
Matt Reed
Byrne Robotics Security
Avatar
Robotmod

Joined: 16 April 2004
Posts: 35941
Posted: 03 January 2008 at 2:20pm | IP Logged | 9  

 Stephen Robinson wrote:
And yes, I know that many college students live with their parents -- just like many adults do, but the key here is that when you're 12 or even 15, you don't aspire to graduate high school... and stay at home. When Peter was a high school student, it made sense because he was a minor and there was no other option.

Still makes sense to me in the context of who Peter is.  He had/has no money.  He's not loaded enough to afford his own place in Manhattan.  Hell, most people I know that live in NYC at his age don't have the money to do that.  Depending on how old Peter is supposed to be now, the fact that he may live with his aunt doesn't make him a loser in my book.  It's a fact of life.  In effect, he still doesn't have another option unless and until they (the writers and/or editorial) decide to have Peter become Harry's roommate because Harry is one of the lucky few to have the means to live in Manhattan at their age.

Back to Top profile | search
 
Frank Balkin
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 17 August 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 141
Posted: 03 January 2008 at 2:26pm | IP Logged | 10  

I never had a problem with a married Spider-Man. 

When I was eight years old, and started reading comics, one of my favorites for several years was Cary Bates and Irv Novick's THE FLASH(which featured a married superhero).  Don't tell me "an eight year old can't identify with a married superhero."  I enjoyed the hell out of that series, and no less than I did SPIDER-MAN by Wein/Andru, BATMAN by David V. Reed/Ernie Chua, and SUPERMAN by Pasko/Swan, the Bob Rozakis TEEN TITANS -- all of which featured "single superheroes." 

I do think it was a mistake to make MJ successful as a model/actress - I think it would have been more interesting and in keeping with the tone of the series to have her eternally struggling to make a living.

Back to Top profile | search
 
Mike Bunge
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 10 June 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 1335
Posted: 03 January 2008 at 2:29pm | IP Logged | 11  

Regarding the JMS comments from Newsarama, I find it pretty funny that he thinks his anal-retentive-fanboy-constructed retcon would have been sooooo superior to JoeQ's "It's just magic" retcon.

Mike

Back to Top profile | search
 
Paulo Pereira
Byrne Robotics Member
Avatar

Joined: 24 April 2006
Posts: 15539
Posted: 03 January 2008 at 2:37pm | IP Logged | 12  


 QUOTE:
Best case scenario: The Brand New Day stories are fun, and a year from now, nobody cares how they got there.

Or, more likely, nobody will remember how they got there and that, I think, is what Marvel is banking on.

As for the rules JMS referred to in that article, re: magic, those probably go down the crapper forever.

I'm just wondering if Mephisto has this sort of power, wouldn't he be able to seriously mess shit up?  Oh, I forgot, I'm not supposed to be asking these types of questions...it's Magic!

(Uh-oh, it's Magic!)

Back to Top profile | search
 

<< Prev Page of 146 Next >>
  Post ReplyPost New Topic
Printable version Printable version

Forum Jump
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot create polls in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum

 Active Topics | Member List | Search | Help | Register | Login