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Patrick T Ditton Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 07 February 2007 Posts: 404
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Posted: 27 February 2007 at 9:38pm | IP Logged | 1
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absolutely
death penalty for them all
and Liefield and Bendis
Edited by Patrick T Ditton on 27 February 2007 at 9:39pm
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Brian Hague Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 14 November 2006 Posts: 8515
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Posted: 27 February 2007 at 9:41pm | IP Logged | 2
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Greg Kirkman wrote: "Brian Hague, it's scary how right you can be at times."
Y'know, Greg, I keep telling people this, and they will not listen to me...!
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David Whiteley Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Posts: 2748
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Posted: 27 February 2007 at 10:05pm | IP Logged | 3
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"and human's are killers"
I am?
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Patrick T Ditton Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 07 February 2007 Posts: 404
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Posted: 27 February 2007 at 11:07pm | IP Logged | 4
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yes - of something - I never said "human's are murderers" - there's a difference.
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David Whiteley Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Posts: 2748
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Posted: 27 February 2007 at 11:17pm | IP Logged | 5
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If this turns into a vegetarian rant, Patrick ... :)
Curious though, for you to expand on what you mean by that. Do you mean
we have the potential to kill? That if we eat meat we kill? That we kill billions
of microscopic bugs daily? Do tell?
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Patrick T Ditton Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 07 February 2007 Posts: 404
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Posted: 27 February 2007 at 11:55pm | IP Logged | 6
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no veggie thing - just basic "we are animals/parasites/primal" thing.
humans kill - we just do - at every level - sometimes more intentionally than others
one of our best talents - one of the driving forces that has propelled our technological growth - is making weapons - go back to cave-men - like in 2001 Space Odessey - the monkey who picked up the club as a weapon won the day.
--- no excuse here - but my keyboard is acting wierd and I'm skipiing letters and having to retype everything four times and it's really annoying - so I must keep this short (or smash my keyboard) --
-- but look at humans on an ecosystem/foodchain - we are at the top and have been for thousands of years. We are predators but also parasites. It's nothing to be ashamed of - I'm proud to have an opposable thumb and higher brain functions - screw that tree climbing crap. But humans are killers, by nature, and it is thru "nurture" that humans have also achieved wonder and beauty that is often breath-taking - but we're still killers.
I'd be happy to discuss this over a friendly beer - at length - but my point was just that Banner is no saint - he created weapons of mass destruction - he knows how to kill - so does the Hulk.
Edited by Patrick T Ditton on 28 February 2007 at 1:19am
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David Whiteley Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004 Posts: 2748
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Posted: 28 February 2007 at 12:28am | IP Logged | 7
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Patrick, cannot argue there too much - I was just curious if you meant as a
species or each one of us individually.
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Patrick T Ditton Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 07 February 2007 Posts: 404
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Posted: 28 February 2007 at 1:18am | IP Logged | 8
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species - we're all different - but deep in our DNA - we're all the same...
killers
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Matt Reed Byrne Robotics Security
Robotmod
Joined: 16 April 2004 Posts: 35927
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Posted: 28 February 2007 at 1:19am | IP Logged | 9
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Jeff Gillmer wrote:
Would Hulk murder someone? No. Is there a chance of someone being killed by collateral damage from a Hulk vs. anyone fight? Yep.
If it can happen to Spider-Man (Capt. Stacy), it sure could happen to Hulk. |
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There's a big difference between writing a story specifically geared toward telling the tale of collateral damage stemming from a single fight between a superhero and a super villain and the insinuation that's been bandied about re: the Hulk for the past several years that he's killed hundreds of people in his rampages through the course of his time in the MU. The former, the story you reference about Captain Stacey's death, was the exception, not the rule, with regard to not only Spider-Man, but MU heroes in general. The latter is a rewriting of the conceit of the genre such that we're now supposed to look with a critical "realistic" eye toward any damage created in this fictional world as damage that impacts innocents in such a way that the heroes are culpable in their deaths (my Thing and Superman punching people through populated buildings springs immediately to mind). As has been said many times, the conceit of the genre is a house of cards. Pull one out because you want to make it "realistic", and the whole thing comes crashing down. Why anyone would want to do that with established mainstream superheroes is beyond me.
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Robert Last Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 07 February 2006 Posts: 615
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Posted: 28 February 2007 at 2:48am | IP Logged | 10
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I'd agree.. every card you pull out makes it more likely the whole thing will come crashing down. I have much more sympathy for writers who instead might point out a card, if you will, and ask the reader to study it, rather than removing it entirely.
I've said before, the look/sound of the genre HAS to change every now and then to keep it fresh, but the structure underneath needs to remain pretty much the same. Every now and then a genius will come along and add to/readjust the foundations, but that takes rare skill.
As you might guess, I'm in the "hulk has never killed" camp. (although What ifs? and Evil Hulks from possible futures/parallel dimensions are fine!)
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Leigh Hunt Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 20 April 2004 Posts: 296
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Posted: 28 February 2007 at 5:58am | IP Logged | 11
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You people have clearly been reading different comics to me all these years. I never thought the Hulk intentionally kills anyone (and nothing in recent Marvel comics has said so either) but I certainly considered as a kid that he would UNintentionally kill people during his rampages. How utterly ridiculous to think he wouldn't!
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Jeff Gillmer Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 30 August 2004 Location: United States Posts: 1920
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Posted: 28 February 2007 at 7:01am | IP Logged | 12
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Totally agree with you there Matt. I guess my main point was that this story had not only been done, it's been done better, and it didn't have to be part of a multi-book, mega company crossover event.
It's a very fragile house of cards, and Marvel seems to be trying to not only shake the table the cards are stacked on, but are bringing in a big fan to blow on the cards as well. From the whole Civil War mess to this Hulk stuff, they seem to be trying their best to take the "FUN" out of comics.
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