| Author |
|
John Byrne
Grumpy Old Guy
Joined: 11 May 2005
Posts: 132644
|
| Posted: 02 July 2006 at 1:05pm | IP Logged | 1
|
|
|
It’s almost as if some people discover that “goodness” and “innocence” are the exceptions and not the rules (and that’s highly subjective), never recover from the shock, and spend the rest of their lives trying to tear down anything that presents itself as such, often blinded to the fact that some things really are what they appear to be. **** Ironically, a work of fiction is, by definition, what it appears to be -- unless the original author says otherwise. There's hardly a story every been written that could not be given a treatment other than what the author intended -- as Moore's complaints about how Hollywood has dealt with his pastiches demonstrate -- yet the mere fact that somethingcan be done is not an indication that it should be done. Going back to the original subject of this thread -- can we imagine how these same people who leap to defend Moore's savaging of properties not his own would have spun things had I been the author of "Lost Girls"? Pedophilia would most certainly have been added to my list of sins.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Darren Taylor
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 April 2004
Location: Scotland
Posts: 6003
|
| Posted: 02 July 2006 at 1:14pm | IP Logged | 2
|
|
|
Part of me feels that the reason for Moores choices of subject matter and characters was for no other reason that sensationalisim. Just think of the free advertising he's got out of the decision!
A professional writer, we might hope, could maybe have put a little more effort into his craft. Even Jackie Collins can write a story about people we "know" are certain actors and actresses but aren't portrayed -as- those people. I'm sure someone with half an ounce of creativity could have thought of three -other- names and plied the material on it's own merits!
Of course then, the book would have had to stood on it's -own- merits and most likely bombed, better that he do it this way and ride the gravy train;-)
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
Darren Taylor
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 April 2004
Location: Scotland
Posts: 6003
|
| Posted: 02 July 2006 at 1:20pm | IP Logged | 3
|
|
|
"Joe and Darren both expressed their reasons and they were different.
One was naked "kids" and the other was copyright infringement."-Andy
I expressed -a- reason. Another is, I've never liked one thing of Moores that I took the time to read. I love Alan Davis's work and enjoyed his time on Captain Britain but still felt the plot to be conveluted in places and cumbersome in others. The best writers are those that present a story, however fantastic, that seems to leave no trace of the writers hand in it's machinations.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
Robert White
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 4560
|
| Posted: 02 July 2006 at 1:36pm | IP Logged | 4
|
|
|
The way we fight it is to not buy into it as being more "sophisticated" than it really is. It is a mental pacifier for some to ease their minds since they are taught as adults that the desire for existential existence, adventure, fun, etc, is a bad thing. It's not any more of a bad thing as self-analysis and pondering the meaning of life is. There is a purpose for all things under the son.
Ultimately the deconstructionists/nihilists end up as limited in vision as their more conservative adversaries.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Darren Taylor
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 22 April 2004
Location: Scotland
Posts: 6003
|
| Posted: 02 July 2006 at 1:41pm | IP Logged | 5
|
|
|
"Ultimately the deconstructionists/nihilists end up as limited in vision as their more conservative adversaries.
"-Robert
I get you but I wonder why anyone might look to limit themselves in such a fashion?
Surely if you are selling a product and said product has stopped selling, you either stop or sell something else?
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
| www
e-mail
|
| |
Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
|
| Posted: 02 July 2006 at 2:02pm | IP Logged | 6
|
|
|
Andy, I've read some chapters of Lost Girls a while back. It's the
aspects of children's books, the illustrative style, the fantasy and of
course the characters appropriated into one adult's morose ideas of eroticism.
Edited by Joe Zhang on 02 July 2006 at 2:03pm
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Ian M. Palmer
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 04 May 2004
Posts: 1342
|
| Posted: 02 July 2006 at 2:34pm | IP Logged | 7
|
|
|
How many Lost Girls threads do we need? Let's talk about religion or something.
IMP.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Arvid Spejare
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 17 April 2004
Location: Sweden
Posts: 386
|
| Posted: 02 July 2006 at 2:37pm | IP Logged | 8
|
|
|
I'm far from a copyright lawyer, but the only fairly definitive thing I could find regarding Peter Pan seems to be that the Hospital gets royalties from the book and play.
And I know even less how a story about, in Neil Gaiman's words "three women whose adventures in girlhood may have inspired respectively, Alice's Adventures In Wonderland, Peter Pan and Wendy, and The Wizard of Oz" is judged any way.
Edited by Arvid Spejare on 02 July 2006 at 2:38pm
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Ian M. Palmer
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 04 May 2004
Posts: 1342
|
| Posted: 02 July 2006 at 2:44pm | IP Logged | 9
|
|
|
All men, regardless of their personal orientation sexually, should be Pro-Choice. It is, after all, none of our business what a woman does with her body.
Makes sense as long as an unborn child is considered a body part. Also helps fathers avoid responsibility for the body part.
Where's my hard hat?
IMP.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
John Mietus
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 9704
|
| Posted: 02 July 2006 at 2:49pm | IP Logged | 10
|
|
|
John Byrne wrote:
Going back to the original subject of this thread --
can we imagine how these same people who leap to defend Moore's
savaging of properties not his own would have spun things had I been the
author of "Lost Girls"? Pedophilia would most certainly have been added
to my list of sins. |
|
|
That's the thing -- if it'd been you (not that you would have done
something like that), stoning would be too good for you. But because it's
Alan Moore, the fanboys' God of Writing Comics, any perverse,
prurient, adolescent scribblings wrapped in pretentious claims at subtext
gets a free pass, even if he himself admits that it's pornography using
other people's characters written specifically with children in mind.
Along the same lines, you get blasted for slow storytelling (I've seen it,
don't ask me to document it, I just remember seeing it), whereas Bendis
takes 9 panels to have Mary Jane fall off a bed. And he's the writing
genius.
I just don't get it.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
David Brunt
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 10 June 2006
Location: United Kingdom
Posts: 154
|
| Posted: 02 July 2006 at 2:52pm | IP Logged | 11
|
|
|
We're getting into hypotheticals here. You say you'd have been labelled a peadophile, I say if you'd written exactly the same story I wouldn't have labelled you that.
If it's all about context then the two quotes I most often see attributed to John Byrne is 'She shouldn't be playing Sue Storm because hispanics with blonde hair look like hookers' and equating the use of the word 'nigger' with mis-use of speech bubble. I'm not talking about using 'nigger' in a historic context or as a piece of dialgogue. The story reported in comics press was equating 'nigger' and 'speech bubble'. They are two of the things that people refer to on message boards.
Just raising a few points as the thread is presumable here for that reason.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
|
| |
Joe Zhang
Byrne Robotics Member
Joined: 16 April 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 12857
|
| Posted: 02 July 2006 at 2:58pm | IP Logged | 12
|
|
|
"Makes sense as long as an unborn child is considered a body part"
I actually agree with you, Ian. It's a dangerous thing to have too narrow a definition of human life.
|
| Back to Top |
profile
| search
e-mail
|
| |
Topic Closed)
