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Topic: eternals....was jack kirby ahead of his time? (Topic Closed Topic Closed) Post ReplyPost New Topic
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Robert Oren
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Posted: 29 July 2006 at 7:28am | IP Logged | 1  

Kirby was just so great and now that he is gone he gets pushed aside alot

there was an issue of tales of suspends in which iron man was fighting the sub mariner half the issue was drawn by an artist i just can't remember sorry.but the action was very bland. then kirby came in the middle of the fight and the pages just exploded with action .....i will never forget that. It just showed what a master he was at what he did !!!!! 

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Matthew McCallum
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Posted: 29 July 2006 at 8:37am | IP Logged | 2  

Chad Carter wrote: The "mystery" is who is wanting an Eternals book by anyone other than Kirby.

Matt Linton wrote: Given that a new Eternals book by Kirby is impossible, it's not that unreasonable.

Actually... I recall an interview Kirby gave where he revealed that he'd figured out a way to come back from the dead, that he had it all worked out. The interviewer as pretty much flumoxed and didn't know how to respond. If anybody could do it, I'm certain it would be Kirby. Perhaps that's who Chad ran into at the Ice Cream place...

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Pascal LISE
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Posted: 29 July 2006 at 8:59am | IP Logged | 3  

The Eternals blew up my mind when I was a kid, just like Machine Man did
and the FF and so many other Kirby comics.

Mebbe that's the reason why it seems I can't get the same juice from any
other creators with a take on a Kirby concept.

Sorry guys, he did it right the first time.
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Joe Zhang
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Posted: 29 July 2006 at 9:37am | IP Logged | 4  

" The Eternals blew up my mind when I was a kid, just like Machine Man did"

Machine Man and Devil Dinosaur did the same for me. Too bad I couldn't find the books after the first few issues.
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Chris Schillig
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Posted: 29 July 2006 at 12:35pm | IP Logged | 5  

I never had trouble finding either Machine Man or Devil Dinosaur in the old comic book spinner rack. The Eternals, though, was another story -- the first issue I bought was #4, the second #8, and then I found #3 in one of those bags of comics you could pick up in department stores.

A lot of the other issues I never saw until years later, and it's only now, with the publication of The Eternals Omnibus, that I am able to read the entire series.

 

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Chad Carter
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Posted: 29 July 2006 at 2:50pm | IP Logged | 6  

"Chad,

Do you feel the same way about people other than Stan Lee and Jack Kirby working on X-Men , or Fantastic Four?  If not, what's the difference, since they're all owned by the company, not the creators"

The difference, in my mind, concerns what I've heard about the New Gods/Eternals idea being very important to Kirby. A kind of culmination of his ideas in the medium, and a way to seperate himself from Stan Lee? I don't know about that, just speculation.

Anything Kirby worked with Lee on, I feel like it's the cornerstones of the comic book upsurge that took place during my young life. The Industry as a whole is wholly in debt to those works of Lee/Kirby, at least superhero comics. In the case of the company that owns those characters, I feel like every effort should be made to hire the best talent to carry on a tradition begun by Lee/Kirby. "Tradition" is a good word, an old word, tied to a time when quality definitely mattered, hand in hand with professionalism.

Kirby's solo career centered around a mythology he was interested in establishing and working in for the rest of his life. There's a personal quality to this series of works, kind of like there is with Eisner's Spirit, Mignola's Hellboy maybe, a universe very specific to those creators. Others CAN work in it, but it defines those men in particular. I don't think anybody would be happy about an ongoing Spirit series or Hellboy not done by the men who created them. Anthology works, sure, as we've seen with both characters. But Grant Morrison going in and taking over the Spirit and doing what he wants, even humbly? Why? What's the point?

And that's what I'm saying. If the Eternals' new series turns out awesome, wonderful. But it's a pointless exercise with a property very closely tied to a great artist. And leave it to Marveless to figure out a way to waste talent. You're saying a Gaiman/JRJR on FF DOESN'T (potentially; again, who knows? Everyone's seemingly forgotten how to write the FF...EVERYONE) help the Industry, create excitement, provide some antitdote to the poison saturating comics

My favorite solo Kirby is THE DEMON, a pulpish potboiler about strange people up against dark forces. It's pure, it has spirit, it has a fascinating premise, and the two page spreads are some of the best Kirby ever produced. EVER. I wish to god he was known more for DEMON than for NEW GODS, frankly. My personal preference. He was way more than a single "idea" that didn't "click" in the eyes of readers and certain EiCs.

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Zaki Hasan
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Posted: 29 July 2006 at 4:01pm | IP Logged | 7  

But it's a pointless exercise with a property very closely tied to a great artist. And leave it to Marveless to figure out a way to waste talent. You're saying a Gaiman/JRJR on FF DOESN'T (potentially; again, who knows? Everyone's seemingly forgotten how to write the FF...EVERYONE) help the Industry, create excitement, provide some antitdote to the poison saturating comics

*****

Why is it a pointless excercise to try to revive a property closely tied to a great artist by trying to get a top-flight creative team to work on it?  One of the advantages is that it can't help but lead to greater exposure to the original (as evidenced by the ginormous Eternals Omnibus now sitting on my bookshelf).  Neal Gaiman is one of the few writers working in comics who can move books based solely on the strength of his name.  Given that, and given the fact that Gaiman didn't want to work on the FF, as you suggest, what were they going to do, hog-tie and water torture him until he acquiesced and wrote something else?  I would think it's just as important to Marvel's bottom-line to take a property that's been flying under the radar for more than twenty years and make it viable (again). 

Edited by Zaki Hasan on 29 July 2006 at 4:59pm
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Matt Linton
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Posted: 29 July 2006 at 4:27pm | IP Logged | 8  

I hate to be the bearer of bad news (for Chad) but Darwyn Cooke is working on a Batman/Spirit one-shot and an ongoing updated Spirit book.
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Matt Reed
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Posted: 29 July 2006 at 4:50pm | IP Logged | 9  

I'm not quite getting the problem here.  Why are the Eternals out-of-bounds for all eternity because Kirby created them?  Is he really the only creator that can write them, even though there have been a bunch of stories starring them not penned and penciled by his hand?  Given that the characters were created for Marvel, and that they're not creator-owned like NEXT MEN and SIN CITY, why are they untouchable?  Furthermore, why is it a "waste of talent" to work on a new series and/or mini-series?  Far from being "a pointless exercise", I think Gaiman and JRjr's book is really good.  Heaven forbid there are those out there who enjoy it, yet are told that they shouldn't because the only person who should evermore hold sway on the characters is Jack Kirby.
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Joe Zhang
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Posted: 29 July 2006 at 5:32pm | IP Logged | 10  

I think Gaiman has as much right as anyone to attempt his own interpretation of Kirby's characters. The problem is when his attitude approaching the characters is "Kirby didn't get it right", a failing that is certainly not exclusive to Gaiman. 
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Ron Chevrier
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Posted: 29 July 2006 at 5:51pm | IP Logged | 11  

    My two cents, for what it's worth: Eternals by Gaiman and Romita Jr. will probably still be a better product abd more faithful to the source material than that weird Chuck Austen version of a few years back.
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Matt Linton
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Posted: 29 July 2006 at 6:07pm | IP Logged | 12  

Thanks, Ron.  I'd managed to completely forget about that until now.
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